The music industry's biggest enemy/threat is itself. Discuss

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I agree for the most part. I feel that the music industry cares so much about making money that it's lost it's way for finding or releasing good music. I'm not saying that the music today is not important, but I think that it's turned more into money than anything else. I think also perhaps the way it markets itself may have done harm, by not fully embracing (at least initially) the use of the internet or digital downloads. Particularly in the early 00's when napster first started. I think if it had somehow embraced this that the industry might not be in such bad shape as it is.

 

 

Also I think it's the biggest threat to itself because now more than ever anyone else can make music on their own and sell it. In some sense the big record companies aren't even needed anymore.

music/art have always been about money, and it doesn't make it any worse or less pure or whatever.

 

Particularly historically, artisans (craftspeople) regarded their art form as a means to an end, with the end being food on the table. I don't see why commercialism ⇒ bad in everyone's mind.

I do agree that commercialism isn't bad.

 

What I'm saying is the way that the music industry has gone about doing it especially recently is bad. And clearly what they are doing must be something wrong because their profits are nothing like they used to be.

i should explain why i've created this thread.

 

i've really only been "into" music for about 3 or 4yrs now and i've come to realise that the industry seems to be destroying itself from the inside. by the industry i mean for the most part music fans. what gets the most amount attention? hatred. you say that you hate coldplay for being pompous pricks and everyone is ready to put you up on some pedestal. you say that you hate kings of leon for being up some labels arse and you're suddenly some hero. does anything get people more riled up than the term "sell out"?

 

music has turned itself into image driven gimmick laden trigger happy machine. we're seemingly incapable of appreciating music for what it is instead we're too busy arguing who has become too "commercial" or why is that popstar covering that awesome indie song, i can't listen to it anymore cos so n so sang it etc etc.

 

i know i'm generalising a fair bit here but that seems to be the vibe that is saturating the industry at the moment. this forum may not be guilty of any of the things i've mentioned but it is inexplicably preoccupied with fighting over why one band is better than another. people seem to be completely incapable of getting it into their heads that there is no such thing as one artist being better than another. we all seem to enjoy hating other music more than appreciating and loving our own favourites.

 

i know for a fact that i'm guilty of a lot of things i'm alleging others of. it really does bring down this beautiful art form. i hope my little rant in some way explains what i'm getting at.

That, I agree with. You can't go to a single fucking music video on youtube without some arrogant bellend going THE 37 PEOPLE WHO DISLIKED THIS PERSONALLY STROKE JUSTIN BIEBER'S PENIS EVERY DAY. And the indie faggotry is especially pronounced recently, but the entitled upper class of music listeners go through phases like this a lot, I think we'll overall be okay.

 

edit: Also, as much as it pains me to say it (I love me my torrents + mediafires) the gobble-gobble-gobble instant gratification pay-nothing culture that feels like it has a right to get anything digital it wants for free isn't helping either. Value for art performance has gone down a lot. It used to be you went to a concert to hear music, and it was a big deal. Then at least you heard them on your nice fancy radio. Then at least you bought their singles on vinyl. Then at LEAST you got the album and listened to it with your friends. Then at least you bought the CD and played it in your car, etc.

 

Now we sort of just download shit, put it on our hard drives (not even necessarily keep it), and go on with our lives. Which isn't to say that that's necessarily bad, it's just a very rapid switch from being performer-oriented to being more, I dunno, recording-oriented isn't the word I want but it's the only appropriate one I can think of. I think we'll adjust eventually, though. I don't forsee the internet police seriously being able to put a stop to illegal downloading, so either we'll live with it and keep going to concerts or the recording medium will take over live performing in the long run. We'll have to see.

 

edit dos: (So now that I understand what you actually meant, I suppose I agree at least to an extent.)

The music industry's biggest enemy/threat is itself. Discuss

 

I feel that they desperately need to change their marketing model, because at the current time, I don't think its working that well. They need to look into the reason why people buy music to start with, then market at those aspects instead of mindlessly just releasing singles that they expect people to buy off itunes and then later buy the album instead of just illegally downloading it for free.

 

In my opinion, the scheme should change from paying money for the sole reason of getting the product (the single, album whatever) to paying money because they want to support the artist, or they will receive other benefits such as bonus material, prerelease tickets, interactive material, etc (I'm sure their are lots of things that could be considered). At the moment, I particularly thinking about the major labels/mainstream industry, their is no symmpathy given whatsoever that that is what needs to be changed. Because it is no the physical product that is being marketed anymore, they needed to change the models to reflect this.

 

This being said, not much of it affects the way I listen to music. I buy vinyl, I get concert tickets, I love bands and not singles, as I am sure lots of people around here do. Another aspect, though not entirely to do with the music industry, is music criticism which could probably have some better standards introduced instead of all these hyped bands that go nowhere.

^Yeah, the business model of the industry as we know it needs to change, but in honesty, the "music industry" has only been around since the invention of the record, so it could just be a passing phase entirely. I wouldn't be surprised if it just had a short-lived little existence due to recorded, physical media before the inevitable advent of recoded, digital media.

 

If the music industry morphed in such a complete way as you suggest, I dunno if we'd even consider it the "music industry" anymore.

Really, I find the only answer is to stop selling music. All the problems would go away, truly.

I dunno, it's a thorny issue. Music will be okay if we stop selling it, I think, cuz I'm pretty sure people won't ever want to give up the concert/live music experience. But on the other hand the record labels are what gets the music out in a consumable form so that people go to the concerts these days, and so on.

I think that now the most important thing are live concerts. It's not that simple for the bands/artists to make a good selling album and get money from it because of digital downloads and sit and wait for the money. I agre with Bryce when he says that the scheme should change to paying money because you want to support the artist, because of course the CD format is almost dead and digital downloads aren't that massive because it's easy to get the stuff for free (I know it's a cultural thing but here we don't really buy digital downloads, but I don't feel bad about it because I spend lots of money in concerts). The money is going from the labels to the concert producers though and they also suck. Lots of bands are ok with fans ilegally downloading their music because they know they can get a bigger audience that way. I mean here I can hear about a random canadian band and get their albums and well, I'll never hear about them on the media here :blank:

 

I think we're very fortunate because we have access to so many music, but for example I'd have to be rich to pay for all the music I get, and I'm sure most of the people here is in the same case :uhoh: but lots of money is going to the music industry anyway. I mean, I've spent like 700 dollars in concerts this year :freak: and just about 100 on CD's

 

And about music turning into a happy machine, well, it just happens. Always the most famous music is the easiest to get into and most of the people is happy with the top 15 songs. I'm not saying that popular music is bad because it's not always the case, but most of the people will listen only to the stuff they find on the radio because it's easier to turn on the radio than searching for bands/music they might like.

I dunno, it's a thorny issue. Music will be okay if we stop selling it, I think, cuz I'm pretty sure people won't ever want to give up the concert/live music experience. But on the other hand the record labels are what gets the music out in a consumable form so that people go to the concerts these days, and so on.

 

I mean, if labels were only used as advertising labels to get music onto the radio and heard and just quit the whole idea of releasing music. Radio stations work on demands, so less popular songs won't get played and the better songs will. People will go to concerts if they like the songs they hear etc. Websites need to be utilised more as well. Everyone is on the internet these days and the best some can do is a myspace page. If you stop selling music, and make it just available on the radio and as a stream on the internet, most of your problems are solved. The only way to buy music should be directly from the band, it wouldn't be that hard to sell mp3s/flac/acc files on the bands website, and possibly have a vinyl order option as well (because lets face it, the is still a demand for it). This way, the band get the full share of profits and the people get what they want. The scheme would change from producing CDs to a demand for people who can make a decent website, or who run music websites which stream ALL music for FREE (enter spotify, last fm etc). The use of last fm to introduce new bands based on what has already been heard is also vital. Finally, enter the importance of a music critic, who is this marketing model, would have a fairly big influence over people who can listen to all the music they want for free. Anyway, just a thought.

^Yeah, I have to say I'm far more naturally inclined to that model, last.fm & co. are already changing the way people consume music drastically, for the better, I think. But no record label would just advertise for the band if the only way to buy was direct from the band :lol: They have to get profits in somewhere, and I think they deserve them at least for marketing.

^The could get it from royalties from the radio stations, and perhaps a portion from the online streaming sites.

Yeah, they could, but I don't see why they would really be flexible enough to want to adjust to something like that. The music industry as we know it would have to go extinct or nearly so before it would reach for little snacks like that. (They already take royalties from on-air/on-line radio, but they wouldn't shift their attention to just that, is what I mean.)

I know it is a bit unrealistic in todays world but without doubt changes will happen in the future if they want to continue to make any money at all. Still, it is all very interesting to look at from a different perspective.

ok guys thanks for the lively discussion but i wasn't quite talking about the welfare of the music industry. i think in a commercial sense it is better than ever (refer to U2 record breaking tour revenues)

 

what i'm talking about is the way the young music lovers of today treat current music. and the obsession we all seem to have with labelling everything. everything is this or that, nothing is plain and simply music anymore. that i think has ostracised and alienated a lot of people who would otherwise be quite passionate about music.

 

That, I agree with. You can't go to a single fucking music video on youtube without some arrogant bellend going THE 37 PEOPLE WHO DISLIKED THIS PERSONALLY STROKE JUSTIN BIEBER'S PENIS EVERY DAY. And the indie faggotry is especially pronounced recently, but the entitled upper class of music listeners go through phases like this a lot, I think we'll overall be okay.

 

 

this is exactly what i mean. that "indie faggotry" (don't quite agree with your wording but it does sum it up quite well) is whats killing music from the inside. as we grow older we'll probably mature and get over that elitism but the next generation will probably be even worse. the way that a lot of the music media is geared doesn't help much either.

 

is this form of segregation all that bad? to most it isn't but personally i struggle with it. i seem to wear a different "hat" with every group of friends. i tell my indie friends i hate mainstream, i tell my mainstream friends that chart topping music "is ok", with my classic rock loving friends i find myself denying my fanboy-ish love for kanye west. maybe it's a little utopian of me to think things could be different, i dunno.

 

maybe i'm just a slightly confused music lover.

 

music has turned itself into image driven gimmick laden trigger happy machine.

 

That's what I've been saying all along, hence the likes of GaGa, Bieber and Jonas Brothers.

It's all about image and nothing else, certainly in "chartland", anyway.:dozey:

Unfortunately, mediocrity now rules.

The music divides us into tribes... [/fanboy]

 

Anyway, discussing your point, I think the main reason for it is that certain people identify themselves with certain types of music and they feel any attack on that type of music is an attack on themselves. I personally don't like classic rock much at all, and struggle to like anything that was released before 2000, but on the other hand, I am really passionate about all sorts of music released since then, seeing as I identify with it and such. Some people, like you said, take this a bit too far when they begin to slander any type of music they don't listen to.

That's what I've been saying all along, hence the likes of GaGa, Bieber and Jonas Brothers.

It's all about image and nothing else, certainly in "chartland", anyway.:dozey:

 

i think every segment of the music industry is like that. like imagine if Fleet Foxes decided to ditch their hairy hippie image and instead started strutting around in spray on jeans and hugo boss shirts? i'm sure there would be exodus against them. the "indie" scene is just as manufactured and image driven.

 

and you're right bryce it is a way of people identifying themselves. but i find that way of self-identification to be based more so in hating certain types of music rather than loving the type of music you identify with. that doesn't sit well with me.

i think every segment of the music industry is like that. like imagine if Fleet Foxes decided to ditch their hairy hippie image and instead started strutting around in spray on jeans and hugo boss shirts? i'm sure there would be exodus against them. the "indie" scene is just as manufactured and image driven.

 

Are you suggesting their image is "manufactured" and contrived, like GaGa's? I don't get that impression.

Anyway, at least they're not plastered all over the media because of their image.

Their music has to do the talking, or they'd be nowhere.

i don't think i worded that very well. i'm not trying to say that problem is with the acts themselves its more so with their fans. their passion for a certain act is founded largely in the way they carry themselves and how they "look" and the stigma that is attached to being a fan of that band. the music often seems secondary.

i don't think i worded that very well. i'm not trying to say that problem is with the acts themselves its more so with their fans. their passion for a certain act is founded largely in the way they carry themselves and how they "look" and the stigma that is attached to being a fan of that band. the music often seems secondary.

 

I agree, which is very sad indeed. There is far too much obsession with "mediocrity".

All I'm saying is, I have seen Fleet Foxes live, and there's no denying their music speaks for itself, whether you're a fan of it or not.

The same can't be said for "image junkies" like GaGa and Bieber.

Take away the smoke and mirrors, and you're left with virtually nothing of any substance.

 

I have even been critical of Coldplay's "Viva La Vida" uniforms. They don't need gimmicks like that. I'd rather they just wore jeans and t-shirts, as they did prior to VLV.;)

 

By the way, live music has always been where it's at, and that hasn't changed - and by that I mean music, not "stage shows"!

The best gigs are still in small, intimate venues with few or no frills.

yeah i'm a big fan of no frills live shows. big reason why i love pearl jam so much.