Audio Interface/piano VST knowledge?

[Kacey]

Hey everyone,

 

There must be some people here who know a lot about audio interfaces. I'm deciding whether or not I should purchase one. It would mainly be for recording piano covers. If I were to use MIDI, is the sound quality going to be that much better using an audio interface, than just a direct connection to the computer? In the past, I have always used live recordings, so I would use it for that as well. I know that should be greatly improved?

 

I was suggested to look into the Steinberg UR22, which appears to be a popular choice.

 

I'm a bit of a recording noob :)

[sheryar90]

Hello Kacey. I'm a recording noob myself but I thought I should get this thread moving so I'll tell you what I think. I'd say go MIDI unless you have an awesome acoustic piano and a pair of good mics. Now if you record MIDI and use the piano voice from your digital keyboard it'll sound pretty average (I think it sounds worse than recording with an instrument cable). Therefore, I suggest you invest in a good piano VST (virtual piano sounds). Majority of these piano VST's have been sampled using an acoustic piano and they sound much better than most digital keyboards. Check out The Giant and Alicia's Keys (both by Native Instruments and around $100 I think). So essentially what you're doing is setting up a MIDI connection between your keyboard and your music recording software (DAW) and using your keyboard to trigger the piano VST.

 

So back to the actual question. Do you require an audio interface for that? Not necessarily. You won't be plugging in any cables in the audio interface since it's a direct connection between the keyboard and your computer. However, if your computer's internal soundcard isn't good enough to handle the VST (good piano VST's are kinda heavy) there's going to be a latency issue when you play i.e. there'll be a lag between when you play a note and when you hear it. If you compensate for the lag by reducing the sample rate, the sound from the VST may click/pop/pause at times. Soo getting an audio interface like the UR22 will take care of that.

 

Don't take what I say at face value obviously. I may be wrong about some things so we should wait for the more experienced coldplayers to confirm :p.

 

p.s. Heard some of your covers. They're fantastic. Imagine what a good sounding piano VST will do to them!

[Kacey]

Thanks Sheryar! Your covers are awesome as well :)

 

I want to get the best sound quality possible from now on. I never really knew what VSTs were. Do you have links for those VSTs? I will probably make my way to Long and Mcquade for advice too, they were the ones who suggested the UR22 to me.

 

I recently bought a new Macbook Pro, with these specs:

8 G Ram

256 SSD

2.6 GHz i5

 

I'm not sure about the sound card, but can you get an idea of what it should be able to handle? I've been using Garageband for my videos. Because these new macs only have the headphone jack, I can't connect a live cord from my piano to the laptop anymore. In my latest video, I just used MIDI, using the included Steinway Grand sampling ( [video=youtube;KeKpFx_LPLU]

). Some quality is still missing in it.

[sheryar90]

Yea the Steinway Grand from Garageband just sounds like a good digital keyboard instead of an acoustic piano to me.

 

Here's a link to the piano samples from Native Instruments (includes The Giant i mentioned earlier): http://www.native-instruments.com/en/products/komplete/keys/

 

You can find demo tracks for all of these samples on that link and decide which one sounds best to you or check Youtube for detailed reviews. There's a lot of choice out there so if for any reason Native doesn't do it for you just google "best piano VST."

 

Ok so about the interface. If you've made up your mind about buying a piano VST don't buy the interface just yet. I mean you have a new macbook pro and you'll mostly be recording just the piano (maybe some strings?). The built in soundcard should be good enough. Close any background processes (Safari, iTunes etc.) for good measure before you record. The more RAM you have available the better I think.

 

The guys at Long & Mcquade will most probably advise you to just get an audio interface if you tell them you want to record music. I'm assuming you're not doing any heavy mixing in Garageband and recording a lot of tracks so I don't see the need for buying an interface yet. Again it depends on how your mac responds to the VST you choose.

 

That's all I can think of for now. Let me know how it goes! :)

[Kacey]

I'm assuming you are using that VST in your videos? If I purchase one, what is included? Can I use it on Garageband?

 

Also, what exactly is music xml format?

[sheryar90]

No I'm actually using Addictive Keys. It's the only one I ever bought. I had recently played the Yamaha U3 at a music store when I was introduced to VST. Found out that Addictive Keys' Modern Upright (http://bit.ly/1Fw9mFB) was sampled using the U3. Plus it was on sale for $50 :p. They also have Studio Grand (http://bit.ly/1xLuq6M) sampled with a Steinway Grand piano. Might be better for solo piano recordings. Again, you'll find lots of reviews on Youtube.

 

Native Instruments is a popular name in music studios so I don't think you can go wrong with that either. Try them all.

 

If you purchase one you get a lot of options to customize the sound with these VSTs. You can change the amount of sustain, timbre, EQ, compression to name a few. You can even add mic or sustain pedal noise!

 

Yup, all of them should work with Garageband. Once the VST is installed, you can access it through Garageband by adding a new track and choosing the VST from sound generator.

 

Don't know much about xml format. Only that if I recorded MIDI piano and I wanted to show you what I played, I would send you the MIDI file. If I wanted to send you more detailed info about the recording (is a note quarter or half etc), I would export the MIDI recording as an XML file. It's used to create piano scores I think.

[Kacey]

Oh my....they are on sale now. This is such perfect timing. I'm thinking of Alicia's Keys and Session Strings for the ultimate combo. Or I maybe get both Alicia's Keys and The Giant. But I will do some more research this weekend before rushing into it. My macbook should be able to handle those without latency problems? I'm also hoping I won't have to adjust too many settings to make it sound right (as I've read in some comments).

 

Also, I've been finding that whenever I record on Garageband, export it to iTunes, add the audio to my video (on iMovie), export as mp4 video file, and finally upload to YouTube, the sound volume is rather low. Do you know the reason behind that?

[sheryar90]

I'm pretty sure you'll have to make some adjustments before you get the desired sound. But yea hopefully not too many. It's different for everyone depending on what they like obviously.

 

About the volume issue, do you find it to be low when you export it to iTunes and listen to it before adding it to iMovie?

[Kacey]

I bought Alicia's Keys. I'm trying to figure out some settings...but it sounds a bit off. Especially a few (two that I've noticed) bass keys. People's recordings on sound cloud and youtube using this VST sound pretty decent though, so perhaps I have to work at it.

[Kacey]

Ok, I think it sounds closer to what I've heard from others, not too bad.

But I think the biggest shortcoming is that I'm finding the lower registers are unable to handle fast pace playing. It's quite muffled, and the action is slow.

 

Still teetering on the thought of purchasing Session Strings...

 

After doing some reading, Synthogy's Ivory II seems to be one of the upper class VSTs? Galaxy's sound pretty good as well.

[sheryar90]

Hmm that sucks if you still find it muffled after all those settings. Try this: http://bit.ly/1vD8Gf3

You can try a lot of VST's for free (for a limited time) on this website including some Ivory II and Galaxy sounds. Better to try them out before buying.

 

Here's a video on how to go about it: http://bit.ly/1rHNJl8

[Charlie17]

I own quite a few piano VST's and although I liked addictive keys a lot for a while, if the "Giant" is on sale. I would get it. The amount of control you can exercise over the sound of the notes, not to mention it just sounds beautiful, make it worth every penny. Another thing you can do that works quite well, is to record your midi performance, and then bounce the tracks with a few different pianos and kind of mix them together. The results are often very nice and surprisingly more expressive sounding than any one VST on its own. And using compression will help to glue the tracks together usually. Pianos are one instrument in particular that benefit from compression for one reason or another. I did a cover of "O" and used only the Giant as my sound source for piano. I've tweaked my personal favorite sound on the giant since then, but you still get an idea of how it sounds doing covers. You need an audio interface to use for recording actual audio. MIDI is not audio, so never believe someone who says, this usb cable or 5pin midi cable is "better sounding." That would be a boldfaced lie. Midi just lets the computer know which note(s) were hit, how hard they were hit and when they were hit. No audio involved. The information then triggers the sample. But if you record a voice with a microphone or and electric guitar with a 1/4 inch cable, the audio interface is necessary and cheap ones will sound bad. The really cheap ones I mean. Anything by Apogee is great and UAD and probably focusright or a Steinberg or Avid Mbox or something will likely do the job. but it's not gonna be audiophile pristine. Depends on what you're budget and priorities are. Hope that helps along with all the other info you've read. Here's a link to "O" if you want to hear the Giant as i tweaked it. And I am by no means a "sound designer." This instrument is straight forward in terms of customizing.

 

https://soundcloud.com/cedmo013/o-10-13-14

[Kacey]

Well I think the audio interface will also function as a sound card, correct? So it should be able to handle all the recording activity as well. I think I will hold off of purchasing one for the moment, and test out more VSTs. I do like The Giant (sounds lovely in your cover :) ), but my tastes edge toward the more mellow sounding pianos in general (just not too much at the bass notes!).

 

I'll likely be uploading some upcoming videos on my YouTube using Alicia's Keys, if anyone is interested.

[Kacey]

About the volume issue, do you find it to be low when you export it to iTunes and listen to it before adding it to iMovie?

 

I listen to my recordings, tracks, and videos using stereo mojito headphones. I really notice it once it's on YouTube and I listen to other videos and compare the volume to mine (but perhaps should test the volume levels throughout the process).

 

Are you saying I should adjust the volume of the track (via the options tab) before adding to iMovie? Is this what you're supposed to do? In the past, I've tried to increase the volume of the audio track on iMovie, but not too much to introduce noise at high velocity playing.

[Charlie17]

If you have your audio file in an MP3 or m4a, actually any audio format, you should at least try out this online free mastering service called LANDR.com. They'll compress your audio to make it competitively loud without going over 0dB which is the level audio begins to distort. It's free unless you request your sound files back in lossless formats like .wav. They send Mp3's back free though. It's a great service considering it's free. Just make sure your track has some "headroom." Approximately -5 dB at the loudest parts is ideal.

I'm not sure about the sound card thing. It's never crossed my mind honestly. I've recorded into my Mac through three audio interfaces and also just the built in mic and the issue of a sound card never came up. Maybe it's different for PCs. And did you think Alecias keys sound more "mellow" than the Giant? I have both and depending on how I set the sound of the keys (from soft to hard) the giant tends to have almost unbearably soft dynamics on the initial attack of the note. Thank you for your compliment on my cover. I'm not a piano player so that one was definitely difficult. And lastly, an audio interface just allows you to record with nice microphones, supply power to condenser mics (ones used to record in studios that sound better but are prone to feedback and handling noise). If I play a midi keyboard with Alecias keys into Logic Pro without an audio interface plugged in, there is zero difference in quality in sound. So I don't personally get the sound card thing. But try lander for making your tracks nice and loud without distorting. :)