colduser Posted July 23, 2009 Author Share Posted July 23, 2009 That completely contradicts the first quote in your sig. In what way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh42 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I am not so sure Anarchy would be a bad thing. I would just be too nervous to find out. People can be mean mean mean! Well you've gotta think of it this way.. Right now, the only thing that's stopping Jon Doe from mugging you in a dark alleyway is the risk of getting caught and being sent to jail for a few years. In an Anarchy, he's running the risk of having someone shooting him in self defense. Crime becomes dangerous in Anarchy. Further, without government handouts, people would become more personally responsible for the things they do, and they'd go out and get jobs. Right now, once the government gives them a little, they just want more, more, more, to the point at which they lose all sense of responsibility. All of the violent thugs would kill each other off in the first few years anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colduser Posted July 23, 2009 Author Share Posted July 23, 2009 This reminds me of the drug war in Mexico. Shows that as soon as you illegallize a product you put it in the hands of thugs and cartels. None of this would be going on if said substances were legal to sell. Great point! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sora267 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 In what way. The mere concept of socialism involves the government taking away some of your personal liberties for the greater "good." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh42 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 This reminds me of the drug war in Mexico. Shows that as soon as you illegallize a product you put it in the hands of thugs and cartels. None of this would be going on if said substances were legal to sell. Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldplayisawesome Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Uh, yea. We're losing 40% of our GDP to senseless taxes. true. however, there is something called minimum wage. without that, it might not matter that you're not being taxed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colduser Posted July 23, 2009 Author Share Posted July 23, 2009 Well you've gotta think of it this way.. Right now, the only thing that's stopping Jon Doe from mugging you in a dark alleyway is the risk of getting caught and being sent to jail for a few years. In an Anarchy, he's running the risk of having someone shooting him in self defense. Crime becomes dangerous in Anarchy. Further, without government handouts, people would become more personally responsible for the things they do, and they'd go out and get jobs. Right now, once the government gives them a little, they just want more, more, more, to the point at which they lose all sense of responsibility. All of the violent thugs would kill each other off in the first few years anyway. You assume all of the thugs will kill each other first. I am not so sure. I guess I would rather have the gov control my life than live in fear of what people may do to me in an anarchy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh42 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 true. however, there is something called minimum wage. without that, it might not matter that you're not being taxed. Companies are going to pay MORE than they do right now. Do you not understand what I've said about four times now? The rich have more money. They use this extra money to give the poor more jobs, often with higher pay than they do now. No one's going to work if they aren't getting paid what they deserve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colduser Posted July 23, 2009 Author Share Posted July 23, 2009 The mere concept of socialism involves the government taking away some of your personal liberties for the greater "good." I see what you are saying. But I mean more in the socialist sense of England, Canada, Sweden...mainly healthcare and such. I am not for a pure Socialist government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colduser Posted July 23, 2009 Author Share Posted July 23, 2009 Companies are going to pay MORE than they do right now. Do you not understand what I've said about four times now? The rich have more money. They use this extra money to give the poor more jobs, often with higher pay than they do now. No one's going to work if they aren't getting paid what they deserve. Your last line is very true! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh42 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sora267 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 true. however, there is something called minimum wage. without that, it might not matter that you're not being taxed. People would be free to move away from jobs which weren't adequately paying their employees, wiping out companies which didn't pay their employees enough to convince them to stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colduser Posted July 23, 2009 Author Share Posted July 23, 2009 People would be free to move away from jobs which weren't adequately paying their employees, wiping out companies which didn't pay their employees enough to convince them to stay. Given the state of the economy, it's not that easy to just walk away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldplayisawesome Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Companies are going to pay MORE than they do right now. Do you not understand what I've said about four times now? The rich have more money. They use this extra money to give the poor more jobs, often with higher pay than they do now. No one's going to work if they aren't getting paid what they deserve. eh, i don't really see that happening, but who knows? :shrug: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh42 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 People would be free to move away from jobs which weren't adequately paying their employees, wiping out companies which didn't pay their employees enough to convince them to stay. Bingo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sora267 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I see what you are saying. But I mean more in the socialist sense of England, Canada, Sweden...mainly healthcare and such. I am not for a pure Socialist government. I remember you saying earlier that you were for capitalism. Yet, universal healthcare eliminates the capitalism involved in the existence of private health insurance companies. Even if the option for private insurance were left open, the fact that people would be taxed for universal healthcare regardless of their insurance choice would cause people to flock to the insurance they're being forced to pay for, leading to a government-held monopoly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colduser Posted July 23, 2009 Author Share Posted July 23, 2009 I've got to run. You all have a great night!:cool3: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh42 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Given the state of the economy, it's not that easy to just walk away. We wouldn't be in the mess if it weren't for government. "Lenin is said to have declared that the best way to destroy the capitalist system was to debauch the currency. By a continuing process of inflation, governments can confiscate, secretly and unobserved, an important part of the wealth of their citizens. By this method they not only confiscate, but they confiscate arbitrarily; and, while the process impoverishes many, it actually enriches some. The sight of this arbitrary rearrangement of riches strikes not only at security but at confidence in the equity of the existing distribution of wealth. Lenin was certainly right. There is no subtler, no surer means of overturning the existing basis of society than to debauch the currency. The process engages all the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and does it in a manner which not one man in a million is able to diagnose." -John Maynard Keynes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colduser Posted July 23, 2009 Author Share Posted July 23, 2009 I remember you saying earlier that you were for capitalism. Yet, universal healthcare eliminates the capitalism involved in the existence of private health insurance companies. Even if the option for private insurance were left open, the fact that people would be taxed for universal healthcare regardless of their insurance choice would cause people to flock to the insurance they're being forced to pay for, leading to a government-held monopoly. No no. That was not my intent. I do not like Capitalism. I was saying that this country will always be Capitalist and will not change. I believe that all people should be able to go to a doctor if they are sick and not have to pay for it. I do not believe that people should have to pay out of pocket for surgeries, medicines, etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh42 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I've got to run. You all have a great night!:cool3: Night bud, hope to talk to you again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh42 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 No no. That was not my intent. I do not like Capitalism. I was saying that this country will always be Capitalist and will not change. I believe that all people should be able to go to a doctor if they are sick and not have to pay for it. I do not believe that people should have to pay out of pocket for surgeries, medicines, etc... lol'd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colduser Posted July 23, 2009 Author Share Posted July 23, 2009 We wouldn't be in the mess if it weren't for government. "Lenin is said to have declared that the best way to destroy the capitalist system was to debauch the currency. By a continuing process of inflation, governments can confiscate, secretly and unobserved, an important part of the wealth of their citizens. By this method they not only confiscate, but they confiscate arbitrarily; and, while the process impoverishes many, it actually enriches some. The sight of this arbitrary rearrangement of riches strikes not only at security but at confidence in the equity of the existing distribution of wealth. Lenin was certainly right. There is no subtler, no surer means of overturning the existing basis of society than to debauch the currency. The process engages all the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and does it in a manner which not one man in a million is able to diagnose." -John Maynard Keynes You are right about the economy and the gov's role in its demise. I just think that this country will never change and Capitalism will always be the status quo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sora267 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Given the state of the economy, it's not that easy to just walk away. Uh, yeah, it would be. The economy goes through natural prosperous periods and recessions; the problems that caused the current recession wouldn't even be relevant within an anarchy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colduser Posted July 23, 2009 Author Share Posted July 23, 2009 lol'd Josh man, people should not go broke just cause they get sick. Surely you don't believe that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colduser Posted July 23, 2009 Author Share Posted July 23, 2009 Uh, yeah, it would be. The economy goes through natural prosperous periods and recessions; the problems that caused the current recession wouldn't even be relevant within an anarchy. Where then would you get the money to live off of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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