I AM POSTING THIS FROM INTERFERENCE, the Coldplaying of the U2 world.

you will find it here too: http://www.interference.com/stories/id174751.html

 

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Interview: Moises Szarf, ‘The Ethereal Connection: a Synthesis of U2 and The Beatles’

By Mark Reed

2007.04

 

 

Moises Szarf has an unusual idea. One not many people may necessarily agree with (some people think he's a bit … odd, which is understandable). His hypothesis is that the eight-year career of The Beatles matches the 30 or so years of U2 in both style and content.

 

“The Ethereal Connection: a Synthesis of U2 and The Beatles” is the website he uses to posit this idea: a vast, and sometimes confusing archive of theories and explorations. It is neither easy to understand or explain.

 

Over several months, Interference engaged in dialog with Szarf to explore and understand the theory and ideas of the site. What is clear, is that Szarf’s work in its current incarnation is not easily digestible; rock ‘n’ roll is a process with three phases, each phase represented by a specific band, and sometimes, it gets complicated.

 

So here we are today, one year and half later, finally, bringing this to a closure in the form of an interview because two recent events have brought a sense of urgency to this matter:

 

-U2 recording their next album at Abbey Road studios.

-Brian Eno is producing Coldplay’s next album.

 

I know it seems confusing at first, but let’s have a little patience and hear it from Szarf directly.

 

Moises, what are you proposing with your hypothesis? What is its central aspect?

 

The main idea is that “rock ‘n’ roll is a process with a purpose.” It is something that had a beginning and, if everything goes well, will have an ending, and in between, a progression takes places. So if rock ‘n’ roll is a process, Elvis was the Big Bang, and from then on, it started to evolve. The first part of the process was carried by The Beatles career, then after their split, rock ‘n’ roll became grandiose and perhaps lost its vision; but then, punk injected new air, giving breathing room for U2 to emerge in a place when an idea doesn't necessarily need musical competence to express itself. U2 is the Second Band carrying the second part of the process, after which a Third Band, will take the process to its conclusion.

 

I believe that everything has purpose in this world, and rock ‘n’ roll shouldn’t be an exception—the highest purpose of rock ‘n’ roll is to change the world. I mean, let’s face it, consciously or unconsciously, that is what we have been aiming at since the first chord rang in Chuck Berry’s guitar. Even in the most carnal stage when rock ‘n’ roll seemed to be a mere gut reaction to the status quo, there were messianic overtones

 

From the first humanitarian concert, the one for Bangladesh organized by George Harrison, up to the RED campaign, rock ‘n’ roll’s humanitarian efforts have become smarter and smarter, but my suggestion is that we are still far away from doing what we really need to do, though definitely heading there. And we will be there when the Third Band concludes their career.

 

Who is the Third Band? Do they exist already?

 

Yes, Coldplay.

 

Why Coldplay?

 

Several reasons. First, the music is great. Second, the band has certain moral. Third, we are considering rock ‘n’ roll as a massive phenomenon, and Coldplay is definitely taking on the responsibility of embracing the massive scale. And fourth, the career of the Third Band, as was the case with the First and Second, has to develop progressively from album to album, and it is at this point that what is currently happening with Brian Eno producing the band. Artistically, Coldplay is obviously at the same transition point that U2 were from “War” into “The Unforgettable Fire.”

 

What about other bands that have been very important for rock ‘n’ roll but are not included in your scheme? Why you make no mention of the Rolling Stones, Led Zeppelin, The Who, Pink Floyd or more frequent ones like Nirvana or Radiohead, for example, or even more, what about Bob Dylan?

 

With respect to the other bands that you mentioned, and many others more, what I would say is the following: If we see rock ‘n’ roll as a whole, and we incorporate the notion that it’s purpose is to make a definitive contribution for the balancing of our planet, the Three Bands—The Beatles, U2, and Coldplay—would be the main parts of that purposeful whole, and they would be the central ones, the Spinal Chord, the Heart, and the Brain, let’s say, and the other rock bands that you mentioned would be other important parts like the stomach, the reproductive organs, the lungs, the kidneys, or the ladder; vital organs needed for the body to survive, but not the central ones.

 

Your website is a chronological comparison of similarities between the album covers of The Beatles and U2, which actually, is seen by many people as a stretch of the imagination.

 

A stretch of the imagination is kind in comparison to some other qualifications that my website has received, and I understand it, it is not something that is easy to swallow. They have to be seen as a whole, it’s easy to dismiss them if you isolate every comparison, but if you consider them in conjunction, a broad picture starts to emerge. I had an encounter with a good friend in which we decided to relate to each other the histories of our favorite bands, his The Beatles, mine U2, using the album covers arranged chronologically as guides, and when he got to the “Sgt. Pepper” period, what he was describing was the same experience I was having at that precise moment with “Achtung Baby” and “Zooropa.” That encounter happened 13 years ago in Venezuela, and it has to be understood that Anglican pop culture, even though very relevant there, it’s not as accessible as here, so even though I had heard of The Beatles, and I knew they were the greatest, I wasn’t aware of the scope of their career. Later I compared the covers of “Achtung Baby” and “Sgt. Pepper,” and the rest is history. It’s about interpreting the art of our spiritual leaders like holy scripture, the difference is that we won’t use it to make war and weapons, but to increase peace and understanding. No rifles, guitars.

 

So if Coldplay is the Third Band are you already looking into connections between their album covers and the ones of The Beatles and U2.

 

You bet I am, and I would say I have found very interesting and meaningful ones, that actually are really encouraging. In fact every one is invited to do the same and pass along their findings. That is why I have called my hypothesis “a Synthesis of U2 and The Beatles” There is a thesis, then in opposition, there is an anthithesis, and the factor that brings the two opposites together is the synthesis. So the role of Coldplay’s album covers is to be a bridge between the ones of The Beatles and U2. Actually, even though not even one time their name is mentioned in my website,the journey is setup as prayer for Coldplay, a prayer for their success, because if they are able to go full circle in the same way as The Beatles and U2 did, the rock ‘n’ roll process would be arriving to the point of the fulfillment of its purpose. It will actually be the end of something, but at the same time the beginning of something else.

 

 

 

But wait a minute, let’s say you are right, and Coldplay reads this interview, wouldn’t they be discouraged to keep on going, or worst wouldn’t they just fuck off on all of this just because a bunch of people is expecting them to make the next album cover with certain traits that would have to match with a predetermined Beatles or U2 album, wouldn’t that be boring, or predictable?

 

Well for example let’s look at what is happening with Coldplay at the moment. Brian Eno is producing their fourth album, and many people have already noticed how similar that is to what U2 did for their fourth album as well. Coldplay is looking for a leap, a significant evolutonary step in their music, like U2 did with “The Unforgettable Fire.” So in one way you can see that as copying U2, but it’s not. The key I believe is for Coldplay to follow their heart, that is the only guarantee of a great album, an unexpected album, despite all the predictability factors involved. And the same applies to the album covers. If an album cover is the reflection of the music which in turn is the reflection of the artist, and the band sticks to that without filtering through any preconceptions, I can almost guarantee that, in Coldplay’s case, their album covers will have meaningful avenues of interpretation with the ones of The Beatles and U2. But as everything, there are pre-determined progressions, forms, patterns, that cannot be avoided, the challenge is to fill the ever-present patterns with new influxes of spirit, every time. And I believe that Coldplay and Brian Eno understand that very well.

 

Previously you commented on the fact that you think rock ‘n’ roll’s humanitarian efforts have evolved over time, from the Bangladesh concert up to the current RED campaign, but that they are not yet where they should be yet, what do you mean by that?

 

The humanitarian efforts are exactly where they should be at the moment, what I am saying is that at some point in the future they will need to evolve further to incorporate a higher knowledge, because what happens? Let’s take the example of Live Aid. It was an amazing event, but it is now known that the money raised for Ethiopia was a drop in the sea of what was needed. I strongly believe that we are headed in the right direction, that it is always worth it to have compassion and justice, and we should always increase it. What makes us different from animals, is that we are able to produce that same fine material that is produced when we die, during our lifetime, through voluntary suffering, and I am referring the kind of suffering that inner work produces, which is the suffering of going against the tide, which is risky and it hurts. The key of balancing the planet is not in saving lives but in increasing inner work while we save lives. The great thing about rock ‘n’ roll is that if it is taken collectively, it is clear that it has been an “awakener” for a very large number of people, and it’s currently awakening to it’s own purpose and fate. I am considering rock ‘n’ roll as a living being, as an individual, and we are all part of it. And of course that not everybody within the rock ‘n’ roll community will agree to this, many will see it as the most ridiculous thing ever proposed, but that’s the the way it is.

 

So if what you are saying is accurate, when the Third Band concludes their career all of this will sink in. That will be the moment in which it will actually starts to take place.

 

Another process might start right away. It sounds messianic because it is messianic, The Beatles were messianic, U2 is messianic, and Coldplay is messianic. Three chords and the truth, its’s the the trinity of rock ‘n’ roll, right?

 

And what happens between now and then?

 

U2 releases its next album, at some point disintegrates, and Coldplay goes on. I mean, do you picture U2 extending their careers a la Rolling Stones. Perhaps, who knows? Personally I wouldn’t like to see a 58 year-old Bono jumping on the stage like teenager, and I don’t think that I am less of a U2 fan for that, I just think it doesn’t fit with them.

 

How does the fact that U2 recently recorded at Abbey Road relates to your hypothesis?

 

If you take the journey in my website you will go through a chronogical comparison which seeks to equate the career of the Beatles with the one of U2, comparing each of their albums in their order of release. Chronologically, “Let it Be” is compared to “How to Dismantle an Atomic Bomb,” and “Abbey Road,” the last Beatles album, will be compared to next U2 album, so the fact that they started to seed the soil for it in Abbey Road is very significant in regards to my proposition. I mean, what at this moment made them do that. Why now? Why not before or after? Perhaps it’s what they needed in order to get it going, to be in that holy peace of ground, to receive that influence. It’s so palpable in “Window in The Skies,” and I believe it will be palpable in the whole album, which they say will be a departure, and I believe it will be similar to the departure The Beatles achieved from “Let it Be” into “Abbey Road.” I mean “Let it Be,” which was originally called “Get Back” was a return to their roots, in the same way as “How to Dismantle an Atomic Bomb” was for U2, so, in synch, an “Abbey Road” kind of leap will take place for the next U2 album.

 

Any other predictions for the future?

 

Perhaps. Coldplay’s next album will be the first one in which a picture of them will appear on the cover?

 

 

 

 

For more information, please visit http://www.theetherealconnection.com </B>

 

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Haha, this is crazy, but I love it. He's more obsessed than all of us put together! :lol:

Are you sure this isn't the guy who founded the 'church of Chris Martin'? :P

 

Despite that, it was a very interesting read. Thanks for posting!

i remember coming across this like a year ago and having a laugh over it. i guess it's an interesting point, but this guy sounds kind of...hardcore, like he actually thinks he has something with this hypothesis :laugh1:. but the beatles, coldplay and U2 are my three favorite bands of all time (well, along with radiohead), so i think it's interesting in that regard.

that was way too many words.

hmm.... interesting. Not so sure i agree with all of it but interestin

Kind of ironic. Rock 'n Roll started in America, but his THREE BANDS are all from Great Britain/Ireland.

Well the roots of rockn'roll are debatable. I say it, of course, started with elvis but the heavy push came from the beatles alone. As far as their predecessors one could make a case for the rolling stones and such but based on the writer's outlook and/or definition of "rock'n roll" u2 is the most successful and fitting predecessor.

As for coldplay, it does seem like a stretch, but u2 reaching their twilight, it's about time that the flag gets handed off and I can't come up with any other candidate but coldplay to carry it. As he said, coldplay has produced astounding music in a very short time. Surely boy and october didn't shoot off to such enormous success and record sales as did parachutes and AROBTTH. and with X&Y breaking charts and with coldplay winning grammy's and brits regularly for every new album or single they release, they surely have potential to one day join the ranks of u2.

Furthermore, Coldplay is made of smart, charitable people and artistically sound artists. the maketradefair campaign signifies that they do give a damn about the world and, while martin isn't yet of "bono" stature, they intend on trying to change the world through music. a key element of rockn'roll.

Some argue that coldplay is too soft musically, but coldplay fans know, by dint of the AROBTTH tour and tracks like politik, GPASUYF, one I love etc. they can and do ROCK OUT(for more see jonny's jazz).

Last but not least they lack no creativity or drive to keep going as long as u2. They are not stuck in a rut and know how to evolve effectively from album to album with new influences being drawn from resulting in fresher tunes. We've heard from every prospekt entry to the constant stream of inspiration to martin's head, with multiple songs being written each day.

 

Simply put, not many bands have what coldpay has, very rarely do you get a lot of talented, driven individuals who A. care about the world and B. strives to become the greatest band in the world while possessing the minds and the potential to do it.

It's tingling to think about it as it's easy to feel that the next album will never be as good as the last. After spending years listening and awing over their last couple albums it feels as if this band cannot possibly improve on that, that the best is over and the next will be a let down. But llooking back, as great as parachutes, AROBTTH, and X&Y were, there were always dissatisfactions. X&Y was wrapped up in a few panicked months, imagine how much better it couldn've been had they had more time.

And now we here that the band has never been comfortable, that chris has never been more prolific, that jonny's guitar has never been better and that this will be an album by a band that's pushed the bar, reached a new height and is exceeding everything they've ever done before. as prospekt said "This is the album I've always wanted them to make"

So lets stop doubting, hold our breath for another month and maybe by then we won't be listening to the "enh, okay." album we've dreaded in our minds, but instead the transcendant "better than anything I've ever heard before" album that will engrave their name deeper into rockn'roll history and push them one step closer to becoming the next u2. The band seems awfully optimistic about it. shouldn't we be? I'm 17 right now, one day I might look back on "42" in the top 100 list of rolling stones "greatest albums of all time". who knows. I don't.

Future Past Present

 

Rock and roll came from (mostly) Irish sand dances and African rhythms (ca. 1830's, near NY), according to a Wiki article on it, so not too far a stretch logistically, but the dates are off a bit!:) It's the reverberation and repetition of these old folk tunes, and various new ones added along the way, that rock & roll stems from. We just think it all began in the 50's!:laugh3:

What I think the Beatles, U2, and Coldplay do is to take the music to a more polished level, add their own twist, and they have the ability to project a range of human emotion so exceptionally and universally well; and with great marketing skills (ie - the Beatles invented Beatlemania). Plus, they retain their humble qualities, even while gaining stardom - something everyone likes, as it makes them all the more like all of us. (sure, they have a bit of an attitude, but then it's earned, and really propels them into other arenas, such as the global issues they each tackle.

But each takes a different twist to it - Harrison was a Beatle, perhaps "the" beatle, but he wasn't the whole effort. U2 is really a team effort, as is Coldplay's. Where U2 goes to the heart of poverty and diseases, Coldplay aims to end the unfair trade practices that have undermined the south for centuries.. Each tackles a different aspect of working on global equality and care, bringing to the forefront problems many have given up on in the past, and with remarkable success! (with a long way to go still as well..)

One thing to remember, though - the creative efforts were (and are) often done by others, often by those forgotten to all but music historians and collectors. Perhaps in their later accomplishments they grow more creative - I'm trying to recall what Lennon had said about which Beatles songs came from R&B artists, and when.. As the cause is good, it's great to see them going for the goals, and I wish them all the luck in the future - if the stars have so divined it, then let it be..

Guys first let me disclose that I am Moises. The guy that was Interviewd in the post above. I am not sure if you guys realized or not. I just wanted to make that clear at this point. I am sorry if not disclosing that from the beginning was not the most kosher thing to do, but from experience i knew it was the most effective as far as getting people to talk and react.

 

I am really happy for the posts by Tnspieler1012 and chuck kottke, and others. It is sort of a miracle to find resonance. I don't know if you have visited my site. It was launched, as a second incarnation, in 2005 right after the release of "How To Dismantle an Atomic Bomb" (www.TheEtherealConnection.com), It is not perfect, it was the best effort I could have done at that moment, today I would change many things. But I believe it is enough to communicate my propositions.

 

Can't wait for those next albums, I mean, U2's and Coldplay's, both due soon.

 

If you are interested in this you can join the facebook group.

 

:)

they just need another "a rush of blood to the head" ;)

I think what you mean is that bands follow a, let's call it prototype, the beatles were the first who followed it well, then U2, and then coldplay, coldplay doesn't emulate U2, they just imitate the rock itself. I think U2 was more massive than the beatles, (massive not popular), it's just like there has to be a band who's the best at its time, first the beatles, then U2 and then coldplay, we'll have forwards other bands.

Well, I feel a bit responsible - I did bring them the keyboard part for Clocks, albeit largely a synthesizer part as well.. Perhaps that's all past now, and they will move on to greener pastures? Other inspirations?

I do have more pieces to offer, though it's hard to judge if they would be as striking as what they had assembled on the AROBTTH album. Tell me what you think I should do then.