mc_squared Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 Europe in turmoil as Ireland says 'no' in EU treaty referendum By Daily Mail Reporter Last updated at 2:47 PM on 13th June 2008 Comments (23) Add to My Stories Irish voters have thrown the European Union into turmoil by rejecting the Lisbon Treaty in a crunch referendum. Hours before the official tally was due to be announced, Irish Justice Minister Dermot Ahern conceded that the 'yes' camp had failed to win the day. Mr Ahern said: 'It looks like this will be a "no" vote. 'At the end of the day, for a myriad of reasons, the people have spoken. 'We will have to wait and see what happens in the rest of the countries. Obviously if we are the only one to reject the treaty that will raise questions. We are in uncharted territories.' The rejection will influence the ratification processes of other countries and effectively kill the Treaty dead. An international referendums expert said Ireland was unlikely to be offered a second referendum as it was when the first Nice Treaty was rejected in 2001 but approved a year later. Knife-edge: Election officials count the ballots for the Lisbon Treaty referendum at the Royal Dublin Society this morning It's a no: Justice Minister Dermot Ahern 'The legal position is that if one country rejects the Treaty, then it falls,' said Professor Matt Qvortrup of Scotland's Robert Gordon University. 'A no verdict in Ireland will also adversely affect the current ratification process of a number of other EU states like Britain, the Czech Republic, Poland and Denmark.' Prof Qvortrup said it was unclear who would take the blame if the Treaty collapsed. 'As individual member state governments negotiated the terms, heads are unlikely to roll in the EU Commission,' he added. Financial markets will probably not be affected by a negative result as the Treaty does not have immediate economic consequences, unlike the turmoil caused when Denmark rejected The Maastricht Treaty in the early 1990s. Ireland is the only EU country to have held a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty, though 18 of the 27 members states have already ratified it. Five constituencies in Dublin showed the 'no' vote well ahead, with three evenly divided and one in favour. Correspondents for public service broadcaster RTE in other parts of the country also said early counting showed 'no' in the lead. In Britain, ministers are likely to insist Parliament will still ratify the controversial EU 'constitution' - even if the Irish kill it off. Downing Street moved to reassure EU partners that it 'has no intention of pulling the plug', although a 'no' result would provide a massive boost to those in Britain opposed to the treaty. Opposition: The 'no' campaign was slick compared to the pro-treaty effort Government sources said a Bill to make legal the document, which hands swathes of power to Brussels, will continue its path through Parliament. The Commons has already approved the treaty and it is now in the Lords awaiting its final reading. In Ireland, many believe that the treaty's complexity and fears about losing Ireland's low corporation tax policies and military neutrality are key factors behind a surge in the opposition. The Dublin government insisted yesterday it was confident of winning. Most political parties, business, trades unions and the powerful farming lobby have been calling for a 'Yes'. Since it joined the EU in 1973, Ireland has pocketed billions in grants which have transformed its economy. During the campaign the European Commission agreed a deliberate policy to shelve controversial issues, such as plans for an EU army. EC president Jose Manuel Barroso said a rejection would be bad for Europe and French Foreign Minister Bernard Kouchner also warned that if Ireland voted 'No', 'the first victim... would be the Irish'. All 27 EU countries must ratify the constitution, which was redrawn and renamed the Lisbon Treaty after French and Dutch voters threw out the original version in 2005. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonsu Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 Hurrah! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPB Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 "Is it safe to come out now?" How do other Europeans on this board feel? Mad at us? Happy with us? I'm very curious. This country is on fire at the moment with the treaty getting turned down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c4e Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 "Is it safe to come out now?" yeah i kinda felt that way too, thats why i didnt want to post here, lol. i think we made the right decision on voting no though (well those who did actaully vote no, i think it was like a 53.4% to 46.6% margin, thats pretty close in itself) what did you vote? how do you (or any other irish person here atm) feel about the result? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc_squared Posted June 13, 2008 Author Share Posted June 13, 2008 Well the point is that at least guys got the chance to vote on it. In UK it feels like the government is operating as a dictatorship.;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPB Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 yeah i kinda felt that way too, thats why i didnt want to post here, lol. i think we made the right decision on voting no though (well those who did actaully vote no, i think it was like a 53.4% to 46.6% margin, thats pretty close in itself) what did you vote? how do you (or any other irish person here atm) feel about the result? i didn't vote - i didn't know enough to vote either way. i do get the feeling tho that cowen is now like the bold schoolboy being summoned by the principal (sarkosy (sp?)) y'know? be interesting to see how this all plays out... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c4e Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 yeah i think thats why alot of people didnt vote at all, 3 mil were registered and only 1.5 million voted - they didnt have a clue what it was about. and a booklet thing was sent around to every house i think, but it was all garbage like, nothing worth reading. but the 'no' campaign people did send around this leaflet explaining what would happen if we voted yes and kept it short and sweet, so that sort geared me towards the 'no' side. i mean it sounded really bad though plus i think brian cowan is the biggest prick in the world:D i mean even he admitted that he didnt read the treaty for christ's sake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TraceOddity Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 :thumbsup:IRELAND!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 Don't know if it's good or bad that Ireland said no in EU treaty referendum... But for the EU it's a slap in the face certainly, because Ireland received millions of subventions from the EU during the last 35 years. This money was responsible for their strong economy today and the fact that Ireland isn't dependent on Great Britain anymore. I think Irishman tend to forget that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Rose Posted June 15, 2008 Share Posted June 15, 2008 Not really, the reason why Ireland rejected the treaty is after getting rid of British control, they didn't want to be controlled by the faceless unelected people in Brussels France & Holland rejected the old treaty a few years back, so it's back to square 1, rewrite parts of the treaty enough to force it though again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPB Posted June 15, 2008 Share Posted June 15, 2008 Larry, its "Irishmen" not "Irishman" - there are more than one of us y'know ;) But I know where you're coming from and it may come across like we're not team players or something, but we really do believe in the EU and are thankful for all the subsidies but our government is widely despised, mired in corruption and completely ineffective in mobilising an efficient "yes" campaign. However I guess all we can do now is wait and see what happens. Hopefully whatever happens will be in the best interests of all 26/27 states and all those hoping to join. @c4e - I agree. Cowen is a totally ineffective, uninspiring leader. Real bummer. @Tracie Morgan - thanks!! CANADA!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc_squared Posted June 15, 2008 Author Share Posted June 15, 2008 Cowen is a totally ineffective, uninspiring leader. Real bummer. Is he gay??:confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Smut Posted June 15, 2008 Share Posted June 15, 2008 In other news, the rest of Europe owe Ireland a big debt of gratitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mad Hatter Posted June 16, 2008 Share Posted June 16, 2008 GO IRELAND. This whole European Union thing is sort of beginning to freak me out. It reminds me of some kind of dystopian story, as though they are pushing for some kind of world government thing. I really don't know that much about it though. It's scaring me a bit. I imagine it would be a good idea for us Americans to learn more about this. Those who haven't been paying attention, anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambergris Posted June 16, 2008 Share Posted June 16, 2008 ^^ Personally I think the European Union is one great community that has achieved a lot of weight and value in terms of cooperation between countries that have been involved in so many wars and global conflicts over years. Something remarkable, never seen in other parts of the world... the union is good I think to keep peace and stability in this old continent. I think, besides all the politics and the red tape (bureaucracy) that people seem not to like so much, the people from those countries know there's a lot more things to share and agree in terms of culture, science, economy, etc... than things to argue and dispute for. But oh well... who ever said was easy to make many agree on things? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matter-Eater Lad Posted June 16, 2008 Share Posted June 16, 2008 Go Ireland! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theroyalty Posted June 16, 2008 Share Posted June 16, 2008 turmoil ? not really, no one's gives a shit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPB Posted June 16, 2008 Share Posted June 16, 2008 ^ Well at least the folk in the street still like us :lol: It seems the beaurocrats in Brussels think differently though :thinking: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc_squared Posted June 16, 2008 Author Share Posted June 16, 2008 ^ Well at least the folk in the street still like us :lol: It seems the beaurocrats in Brussels think differently though :thinking: That's because they can see their cash-cow disappearing before their eyes!!:rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPB Posted June 16, 2008 Share Posted June 16, 2008 Mark, I can always appreciate your non-world weary, semi-cynical comments :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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