Sounds good to me! Economics is a factor in everyone's choices without a doubt, mine as well. I can understand what we all find desirable with SUV's, but there are so many caveats to them when it comes to their effect on the environment, and yes, these smaller cars are easy to park, easy to find parking spots that they fit in! Hm, so it's the interesting design that has you looking at the Citroen.. I often wonder if it's just a change of pace we're looking for, as we get bored with the looks of the things we use on a daily basis.. so retro is in vogue now!

The trick will be to blend styles and desirable characteristics with green approaches to auto designs...

What if the back end of the car were stretched out longer and tapered gradually? Probably harder to park I suppose.. Well, aerodynamics is maybe 24% give or take of the energy consumption end of things, so there's room to improve everywhere else. Body weight isn't something most of us think about when we look for a car either, as long as the handling is good.. hm.. batteries are positioned low, so the center of gravity perhaps compensates in lower weight vehicles..

And these newer cars have better aerodynamics than their predecessors, and by far better than SUV's. So that's a plus. What about an electric or a hybrid? Have you considered them, or are they simply too expensive for a lease?

Oh thier not too expensive at all, in fairness I would drive a hybrid if they made any that I liked the look of, but the diesel version of the DS3 can apparantly get around 70 MPG which is great economy.

I used to think this was about cars that were the colour green when I first started coming here.

Oh thier not too expensive at all, in fairness I would drive a hybrid if they made any that I liked the look of, but the diesel version of the DS3 can apparantly get around 70 MPG which is great economy.

> That's good to know - for a while the price was substantially higher, so that's quite an improvement. 70MPG Imperial converts to around 58 MPG American, so that's an excellent step in the right direction!

Efficiency is the biggest part of the answer, imagine if the auto makers were required to make all new cars get 70 MPG or better - what a world of difference that would make on the global environment.

I used to think this was about cars that were the colour green when I first started coming here.

> :laugh3: I suppose that could be the case - I did see a car covered with living grass once.. kinda fits both parameters!

When did you come to realize green was a symbol for earth-friendly products?

I used to think this was about cars that were the colour green when I first started coming here.

 

Not envious ones?:P

Wet Greasy roads are fun to drive on at night :)

 

The problem of driving to Salisbury is that it's down-hill from here (an overall drop of around 750ft) so going to Salisbury if the traffic is nice I can get 65/66 MPG, but coming back the hills knock the economy back to the low 50s

Why do you want a Citroen DS3?

 

I know 1 good reason not to want a Citroen DS3

It's French and French cars go wrong and cost a lot to repair as normally it's relates to the cut-and-shut job the French car companies do when turning from Left to right hand drive.

> That's good to know - for a while the price was substantially higher, so that's quite an improvement. 70MPG Imperial converts to around 58 MPG American, so that's an excellent step in the right direction!

Efficiency is the biggest part of the answer, imagine if the auto makers were required to make all new cars get 70 MPG or better - what a world of difference that would make on the global environment.

 

In the late 80s early 90s, didn't some American members of senate want to set in law a sliding scale for minimum economy raising every few years, but got beaten back to accepting a stupidly low minimum figure?

 

Imagine if that was the case back in the early 90s if they set a decent MPG figure, everyday cars could be doing 100MPG by now

I know 1 good reason not to want a Citroen DS3

It's French and French cars go wrong and cost a lot to repair as normally it's relates to the cut-and-shut job the French car companies do when turning from Left to right hand drive.

 

Thier better than English cars.

Thier better than English cars.

 

Better than an Ariel Atom? :laugh3:

 

Your forgetting that England hasn't got any big-table companies left, either sold off (Jaguar Land Rover) or bust (Rover).

I know absolutely nothing about cars, I have no car or license.

 

Insurance replaced the car of my father because she was destroyed by hail.

the Renault Clio. but he always had the Fiat.

I can not say is ecologically

http://www.renault.fr/gamme-renault/vehicules-particuliers/clio/clio-berline/

Better than an Ariel Atom? :laugh3:

 

Your forgetting that England hasn't got any big-table companies left, either sold off (Jaguar Land Rover) or bust (Rover).

 

I was refering to my car(ok so it's only English in the traditonal sense but still made and designed her), I don't know why anyone would buy an Atom, you might as well buy a Superbike which is just as fast-or slightly faster in fact in a straight line but slower in corners and at about £10k new considerably cheaper too.

In the late 80s early 90s, didn't some American members of senate want to set in law a sliding scale for minimum economy raising every few years, but got beaten back to accepting a stupidly low minimum figure?

 

Imagine if that was the case back in the early 90s if they set a decent MPG figure, everyday cars could be doing 100MPG by now

> Naturally so, but like anything good proposed, it slid - off the table. Beaten back? More like promised really good lobbying jobs when their rotation was up, so the revolving door works it's charm.. that or some back-channel money for re-elections - which is worse now than ever before. What science tells us Congress dithers on and then moves at a snail's pace towards correcting the matter - what's it like in the U.K in that regard?

Absolutely! We've had the technologies for a long time now, and with more emphasis on energy efficiency we would already be at that mark - I agree.

Now, if only one had the political answer, and could use the Einstein Express to go back in time and fix the mess we're in..

Some are saying it's time for revolution to get things to really change - the 60's was a pretty messy time and lots of mistakes were made back then, so if we're going to go that route, we had better be smarter this time around..

 

 

I was refering to my car(ok so it's only English in the traditonal sense but still made and designed her), I don't know why anyone would buy an Atom, you might as well buy a Superbike which is just as fast-or slightly faster in fact in a straight line but slower in corners and at about £10k new considerably cheaper too.

 

Reason to buy an Atom over a superbike - it doesn't fall over when you come to a stop - you don't have to wear leathers/helmet to drive it.

 

Someone had work has a 4 year old Citroen C3 which has just had £500 spent on it as something to do with the accelerator broke where it's got forced into right hand drive, most of the job was labour.

I was refering to my car(ok so it's only English in the traditonal sense but still made and designed her), I don't know why anyone would buy an Atom, you might as well buy a Superbike which is just as fast-or slightly faster in fact in a straight line but slower in corners and at about £10k new considerably cheaper too.

>:laugh3: I looked at the Ariel Atom on-line, and it's easy to see why someone would buy one - because (a) they're like kids and want a racing car, and (b) it's fun to drive one.. on warm sunny days above 20C! :lol:

I think that's fine for a week-end cruise or some after work tooling, but obviously it's impractical on a regular basis. Hey, wait a minute - Rolls Royce is still made in England, right?? A bit pricey, but built to last!:smug:

Cycle Cars are good machines that get excellent gas mileage - I found a pretty cool site that showcases what's coming and what's available today! Commute Cars - Electric-Bikes.com

Reason to buy an Atom over a superbike - it doesn't fall over when you come to a stop - you don't have to wear leathers/helmet to drive it.

 

Someone had work has a 4 year old Citroen C3 which has just had £500 spent on it as something to do with the accelerator broke where it's got forced into right hand drive, most of the job was labour.

 

Bikes only fall over when they stop if thier badly ridden:laugh3:, out of the 2 I think I would personally choose a bike over one, I've heard that French cars can play up but I think that's true of anything, my car has had an issue with the alternator and a dodgy handbrake since I've had it too.

I think we're missing the point here. If you people in the UK would just drive on the right side of the road like most of the rest of the world does, there would be no problems! :P Viva La France! :laugh3:

Don't France and the UK work together on car manufacturing? Seems like I recall that from somewhere..

I find the idea of GREEN CARS appealing and the overview of CARE2 Causes contained this article that I found very interesting so I decided to post it here as well. Enjoy! :sunny:

 

 

from Environment & Wildlife

Drivers Save Money With New Green GPS Technology

 

Computer scientists at the University of Illinois have developed a global positioning system that not only calculates the shortest and fastest routes, it also projects the most fuel-efficient route.

 

Built to run on today's internet connected smartphones, the "Green GPS" links to the car's onboard computer using an inexpensive, off-the-shelf wireless adapter.

 

The car's onboard diagnostics system uploads information about engine performance and fuel efficiency to the phone, which uses the data to compute the greenest route.

 

In preliminary experiments, researchers were able to show that following the suggestion of Green GPS saves 13 percent more fuel over the fastest route and 6 percent over the shortest. The initial test was conducted on 16 cars of various types that collectively drove for 1,000 miles in Urbana-Champaign, a city of 170,000.

 

"Currently at least 30 percent of total energy in the United States is spent on cars," said Principal Investigator Tarek Abdelzaher, associate professor of computer science and researcher in the Coordinated Science Laboratory. "By saving even five percent of that cost, we can save the same amount of total energy spent on the nation's entire information technology infrastructure."

 

The Green GPS units will be installed on up to 200 fleet vehicles used by the Urbana-Champaign campus, including full-size vans that often carry 1,000 pounds or more in tools and equipment.

 

Abdelzaher hopes that by collaborating with IBM, the University's Green GPS research will eventually be tested in heavily urban areas with greater stop-and-go traffic.

That's an excellent step to be making - I do hope the idea catches on elsewhere! Thanks for posting that Nancy :).

If we save 5% here, 10% there, eventually the total makes a big change in our overall carbon footprint.

But if everybody decides to take the most fuel-efficient route causing it to block up than it won't be the most fuel-efficient :P

 

I need to find myself a new route to work for the next couple months to avoid the roadworks trying to improve an accident black-spot (which could easily be solved by making that lane one-way forcing any cars wanting to turn into the lane to go up the road a bit more to turn into a proper road)

From Care2Causes I found this article on Fuel-efficient cars:

 

The best place to start saving fuel? Choose a fuel-efficient car.

 

Fuel prices are up–way up, and drivers are desperate for a way to avoid what feels like highway robbery at the gas pump.

 

Despite the fact that this is the second time gas prices have been over $4 in less than four years, Americans still aren’t buying fuel-efficient cars. One reason might be that most people believe high fuel prices are only something that must be tolerated temporarily. Another might be that they just don’t like the small, weak reputation that American’s associate with super-efficient cars.

 

As Brian Merchant of TreeHugger points out, “we figured out how to produce cars that get 40 or so mpg some 60 years ago. And only in the last few years have we really started improving on that.”

 

Why? “Fuel efficiency never really needed to improve as long as gas was cheap — the pollution they emitted was poorly understood early on, and there was no real reason to spend too much time and energy on increasing a cars’ gas mileage.”

 

Well gas isn’t cheap anymore. And as we wave goodbye to peak oil in our rear-view mirrors, it’s probably safe to say that our days of inefficient, gas-guzzling SUVs and luxury cars are numbered as well.

 

Click to expand the infographic (to be found using the link below), and scroll through the timeline to see the most promising advances in fuel-economy for the past 100 years.

 

Created By WellHome Energy Audits and Insulation

 

Image Credit: Flickr – Chego 101

 

 

Read more: http://www.care2.com/greenliving/100-year-search-for-fuel-efficient-car.html#ixzz1LzHPVpfS

 

Read more: http://www.care2.com/greenliving/100-year-search-for-fuel-efficient-car.html#ixzz1LzFoCwu6

 

Related:

15 Easy Ways to Save Gas

Are Electric Cars Really Better for the Environment?

Top 5 All-Electric Vehicles of 2011

Hmm, well, if one were to truly analyze the nature of Americans and their buying habits.. I would have to say it's a lot more than the "weak reputation" of smaller autos which drives people's choices..

Americans buy "luxury automobiles" (forget what they tell you, this is the real deal) - because of savvy marketing and the "grand" feel one gets in a big box auto.

It's even more than that - it has to do with equating individual value with automobile size and appearance, and the marketing people know how to push all the buttons in people's minds. And big autos are marketed extensively, since the lion's share of the profits made by companies is with the big ticket items - SUV's full-sized pickups, luxury loaded vehicles, and the things pulled behind them - big boats, campers, etc.

Then there's "keeping up with the Jones's" here in status symbol land. And big vehicles make people feel more powerful - it's got it's ego appeals without a doubt, acts as a living room on wheels, and it's like riding on top of the tallest horse or camel. And it consumes "food" like the biggest animals too!

But when the squeeze is in, yes, high fuel prices have gotten American's scrambling for cover, before their financial roofs fall in!:laugh3: It never fails - just like in the 70's..

I think the reputation of super-efficient cars is a little bit of a detractor from the past, certainly played to the hilt by the car companies to push the big cars instead, but today's super-efficient cars have plenty of power for their size and weight, so the more they are given the chance to prove themselves, the more people will want them.

Truthfully, we've had cars that could get 40 MPG as far back as 1911, 100 years ago - the cyclecars - which were fuel efficient and inexpensive, but were undone because of poor design, low fuel prices, and competition from mass-produced cars. And that's about when the luxury car market began too, which was pushed as symbolic of wealth and worth. Electrics go even further back, into the late 1800's - so one might say, we've come full circle!

Thanks for the article and links - will check them out!;)

PS - one thing also - it's something of the deal with patterns of behavior, since people here pattern themselves after what their parents and grandparents drove; so the pattern is often repeated without much thought.

The idea of hauling things has a certain appeal as well - people, building materials, toys, etc. - the Island effect, where one thinks of home as a castle, which has a draw bridge and a moat, and one needs a ship to ship things in! Kinda the 'haul-a-family I'm proud of' thing going on there as well (which the marketing people push all the buttons on) - which then confers to the driver a sense of importance and control over everyone else's experience. I'm not saying this is all bad, but it could use some modifying to make our world a livable place - since a lot of it is just for nest feathers (and profits).

The Toyota Prius uses what is termed an 'Atkins Cycle' engine, and the engine while still conventional, uses variable valve timing to mimic the Atkins cycle.

Another innovation which caught my attention is the Scuderi split-cycle engine, which holds promise as being even more efficient - giving us more power and less waste heat from an engine.

They have actually tested one in a Nissan! If you are interested, here's a link: Scuderi Engine Significantly Increases MPG Operating in a Nissan Sentra Says Independent Lab Study | Scuderi Engine

Increasing mileage by 33% definitely makes sense, with no loss of power. Now coupling that with lighter, stronger eco-composite bodies, low drag coefficients, regenerative brakes, and true hybrid designs should get us to top the 100 MPG mark quite easily.

Add to that more earth friendly rubber tires (from crops such as Russian dandelions and other highly productive rubber crops), plus other bio-synthetics, makes for a lighter tread on earth as well..

But if everybody decides to take the most fuel-efficient route causing it to block up than it won't be the most fuel-efficient :P

 

That would be true if everyone does that. More likely that most will just do what they usually do - drive like nuts and get there as fast as they can.:laugh3: (because they're horses in a race) Ah, Friday is when the loonies are all released onto the roads here - I see nothing much changing.. faster faster, the lights are turning red! Life in the fast lane, overdrive, all the time. I suppose drivers are more civilized in the UK?

 

I need to find myself a new route to work for the next couple months to avoid the roadworks trying to improve an accident black-spot (which could easily be solved by making that lane one-way forcing any cars wanting to turn into the lane to go up the road a bit more to turn into a proper road)

 

> Sounds like a traffic engineering problem, solvable with some common sense. But public works don't always involve common sense solutions! Which is why we need to implement the real solution to driving to work. Simply live at work! (actually this is often the case in California, where the commute can be 2 hours one-way)