Destrokk Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 We should still make some noise about this, even if the bill is dropped :blank: I cant imagine trying to get into music.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobalt Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Anonymous “operative” Barret Brown told RT.com that ““It was in retaliation for Megaupload,” that “more is coming” and that this was part of an effort to “damage campaign raising abilities of remaining Democrats who support SOPA.” Fuckin' Barrett Brown, always comes out whenever Anon does something newsworthy and speaks like he is their spokesperson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiame Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 The record companies can not get around that the simple fact that 1 "illegal" download does not equal 1 lost sale, even though studies have shown that people whom download illegally buy more music. Exactly, exactly, exactly. This point can't be emphasized enough. So true. Illegal downloading of material is good advertisement for companies - if someone likes what they hear/see on a download it pushes them to go buy it. http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2011/mar/28/global-recorded-music-sales-fall That's what they are worried about. Everything pointed to them having more money if SOPA and PIPA passed. They aren't content with the industry moving away from them into new areas - they want to shackle it down to where it was in the fifties where they all had complete economic control of their expertise not just most. One illegal download does not equate to one lost sale. This is true. They know this is true. And trust me, these media companies have seen more data than you have seen they are far more aware of what is happening. The issue is about control and greed. Anyway, SOPA didn't pass thanks to the White House's statements and the public getting behind their government and more and more people not allowing themselves to be pushed over by corporations flashing money. PIPA won't pass either. Traditional media will continue to fight against government and the people - but they aren't going to get away with as much control as they would like. They will have to settle for less - but I fear with their amount of influence and their amount of money that they will manage to squeeze something out of this. But with the take down on Megaupload it's kind of a win-lose situation. But it looks like that was going to happen regardless - that site had been targeted for years. This all just shows how much people the people hold. This is one of the only issues people have joined as a collective and spoken for something and overall it has proven to be effective. Imagine what could have been done if the internet community did the same over other things. Like Manning, or the wars in the middle east, or Guantanamo? But they didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busybeeburns Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Two lessons from the Megaupload seizure Commentary from Glenn Greenwald (Salon) Two events this week produced some serious cognitive dissonance. First, Congressional leaders sheepishly announced that they were withdrawing (at least for the time being) two bills heavily backed by the entertainment industry — the PROTECT IP Act (PIPA) in the Senate and Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA) in the House – in the wake of vocal online citizen protests (and, more significantly, coordinated opposition from the powerful Silicon Valley industry). Critics insisted that these bills were dangerous because they empowered the U.S. Government, based on mere accusations of piracy and copyright infringement, to shut down websites without any real due process. But just as the celebrations began over the saving of Internet Freedom, something else happened: the U.S. Justice Department not only indicted the owners of one of the world’s largest websites, the file-sharing site Megaupload, but also seized and shut down that site, and also seized or froze millions of dollars of its assets — all based on the unproved accusations, set forth in an indictment, that the site deliberately aided copyright infringement. In other words, many SOPA opponents were confused and even shocked when they learned that the very power they feared the most in that bill — the power of the U.S. Government to seize and shut down websites based solely on accusations, with no trial — is a power the U.S. Government already possesses and, obviously, is willing and able to exercise even against the world’s largest sites (they have this power thanks to the the 2008 PRO-IP Act pushed by the same industry servants in Congress behind SOPA as well as by forfeiture laws used to seize the property of accused-but-not-convicted drug dealers). This all reminded me quite a bit of the shock and outrage that arose last month over the fact that Barack Obama signed into law a bill (the NDAA) vesting him with the power to military detain people without charges, even though, as I pointed out the very first time I wrote about that bill, indefinite detention is already a power the U.S. Government under both Bush and Obama has seized and routinely and aggressively exercises. I’m not minimizing the importance of either fight: it’s true that SOPA (like the NDAA) would codify these radical powers further and even expand them beyond what the U.S. Government already wields (regarding SOPA’s unique provisions, see Julian Sanchez’ typically thorough analysis). But the defining power that had everyone so up in arms about SOPA — shutting down websites with no trial — is one that already exists in quite a robust form, as any thwarted visitors to Megaupload will discover. There are two points worth making about all of this: (1) It’s wildly under-appreciated how unrestrained is the Government’s power to do what it wants, and how little effect these debates over various proposed laws have on that power. Contrary to how it was portrayed, the Obama administration’s threatened veto of the NDAA rested largely on the assertion that they did not need a law vesting them with indefinite detention powers because they already have full power to detain people without a trial: not because any actual law expressly vested that power, but because the Bush and Obama DOJs both claimed the 2001 AUMF silently (“implicitly”) authorized it and deferential courts have largely acquiesced to that claim. Thus, Obama argued about indefinite detention in his NDAA veto threat that “the authorities codified in this section already exist” and therefore “the Administration does not believe codification is necessary,” and in his Signing Statement Obama similarly asserted that “the executive branch already has the authority to detain in military custody” accused Terrorists “and as Commander in Chief I have directed the military to do so where appropriate.” In other words: we don’t need any law expressly stating that we can imprison people without charges: we do it when we want without that law. That’s more or less what happened with the SOPA fight. It’s true that website-seizures-without-trials are not quite as lawless as indefinite detentions, since there are actual statutes conferring this power. But it nonetheless sends a very clear message when citizens celebrate a rare victory in denying the Government a power it seeks — the power to shut down websites without a trial — only for the Government to turn around the very next day and shut down one of the world’s largest and best-known sites. Whether intended or not, the message is unmistakable: Congratulations, citizens, on your cute little “democracy” victory in denying us the power to shut down websites without a trial: we’re now going to shut down one of your most popular websites without a trial. (2) The U.S. really is a society that simply no longer believes in due process: once the defining feature of American freedom that is now scorned as some sort of fringe, radical, academic doctrine. That is not hyperbole. Supporters of both political parties endorse, or at least tolerate, all manner of government punishment without so much as the pretense of a trial, based solely on government accusation: imprisonment for life, renditions to other countries, even assassinations of their fellow citizens. Simply uttering the word Terrorist, without proving it, is sufficient. And now here is Megaupload being completely destroyed — its website shuttered, its assets seized, ongoing business rendered impossible — based solely on the unproven accusation of Piracy. It’s true, as Sanchez observes, that “the owners of Megaupload don’t seem like particularly sympathetic characters,” but he also details that there are difficult and weighty issues that would have to be resolved to prove they engaged in criminal conduct. Megaupload obviously contains numerous infringing videos, but so does YouTube, yet both sites also entail numerous legal activities as well. As Sanchez put it: “most people, presumably, recognize that shutting down YouTube in order to disable access to those videos would not be worth the enormous cost to protected speech.” The Indictment is a classic one-side-of-the-story document; even the most mediocre lawyers can paint any picture they want when unchallenged. That’s why the government is not supposed to dole out punishments based on accusatory instruments, but only after those accusations are proved in an adversarial proceeding. Whatever else is true, those issues should be decided upon a full trial in a court of law, not by government decree. Especially when it comes to Draconian government punishments — destroying businesses, shutting down websites, imprisoning people for life, assassinating them — what distinguishes a tyrannical society from a free one is whether the government is first required to prove guilt in a fair, adversarial proceeding. This is a precept Americans were once taught about why their country was superior, was reflexively understood, and was enshrined as the core political principle: “no person shall be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law.” It’s simply not a principle that is believed in any longer, and therefore is not remotely observed. http://www.salon.com/2012/01/21/two_lessons_from_the_megaupload_seizure/singleton/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DefDazz Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 A very interesting and informative video from TED. It gives you an idea of the back story to this and the reasons why it is bad (not bad for illegal downloaders) but for those who aren't. A very well thought out and put together presentation: [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9h2dF-IsH0I&feature=plcp&context=C3455d77UDOEgsToPDskK-mugtqUfzq29pvZbjq3Es]Defend our freedom to share (or why SOPA is a bad idea) - YouTube[/ame] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheese Nip 2 Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Something just crossed my mind. Do you think this will effect file sharing sites like media fire? That would completely invalidate the multimedia section. That'd be a serious bummer. correct me if I'm wrong, but file sharing websites are legal, as long as you own the file? I never download songs illegally cause I like the artists to get paid, but I do download unreleased stuff there every now and again, and it seems like with SOPA they could shut it down right? I don't know very much about this subject (I'm not a big Internet fan), but I seems like people could, in theory, use this for selfish gain, such as blocking a competitors website or someone blocking news that would affect there campaign or something. Am I correct in thinking this? Like I said, I don't really follow politics.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saffire Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Anyway, SOPA didn't pass thanks to the White House's statements and the public getting behind their government and more and more people not allowing themselves to be pushed over by corporations flashing money. PIPA won't pass either. I think it's funny you actually believe corporations can bribe the government when it's the government that prints the money and has the power to tax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saffire Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I don't know very much about this subject (I'm not a big Internet fan), but I seems like people could, in theory, use this for selfish gain, such as blocking a competitors website or someone blocking news that would affect there campaign or something. Am I correct in thinking this? Like I said, I don't really follow politics.... You're right, And this is precisely why it's being done. Music/Movie downloaders are considered to be "cheating", in a similar way to how Automobile manufacturers were "cheating" the horse-and-buggy companies. Technology changes things, and these corporations haven't accepted that. They need to adopt new business models, but they refuse to do it, so they're using the government and propaganda. One possible alternative is for artists to simply ditch all the middle-men and accept donations online, a la Radiohead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiame Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I think it's funny you actually believe corporations can bribe the government when it's the government that prints the money and has the power to tax. Once again, you do your trademark "ignore everything else and only respond to 1 line" move. Anyway, you view government be this single entity that does everything and everything effects it. This is not true. There are many branches of government and many of them have very little to do with one another. I think it's funny that you won't accept the fact that every piece of anti-piracy legislation that has been either passed or voted for has been solely paid for and lobbied for by the entertainment industry. You just ignore this and act like all branches of the government want to destroy the internet - which is total bullshit. The White House has made numerous official statements saying they don't support it and the majority of congress don't support it either. Corporations aren't bribing "THE GOVERNMENT!" corporations are "sponsoring" members of congress with multi millions of dollars to co-sign anti piracy legislation. It's simple really. Every member of congress who voted for SOPA was sponsored and funded by a traditional media company. And you just can't see the connection here. It's not rocket science buddy. Oh wait, you just posted this: Technology changes things, and these corporations haven't accepted that. They need to adopt new business models, but they refuse to do it, so they're using the government and propaganda. So it seems you do agree with me now. cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DefDazz Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Something just crossed my mind. Do you think this will effect file sharing sites like media fire? That would completely invalidate the multimedia section. That'd be a serious bummer. correct me if I'm wrong, but file sharing websites are legal, as long as you own the file? I never download songs illegally cause I like the artists to get paid, but I do download unreleased stuff there every now and again, and it seems like with SOPA they could shut it down right? Yes! Megaupload was shut down this week. Regardless of whether any of it's users were doing legit stuff. But let's face it many file sites like that are shady. The people running Megaupload made millions and like the original Napster people, were idiots. If they policed their own sites then they would still be up and the many users who use them in a legit way could still have access. Napster was great for Live music recorded by fans but they never removed the official albums. So a great thing was lost. If Napster had changed they might have made friends with artists and the record industry - more importantly artists. In the same way YouTube could have readdressed their site before Viacom brought their legal action. R.E.M. used to have an agreement with fan sites that they could have a sharing hub for live concerts - fan recorded stuff as long as they didn't have official albums in it. Napster could have been like that for all artists and it could have had loads of ads that gave revenue to every artist who used it. I would say the Multimedia section of this site would be something to be readdressed if SOPA passed with little change to it. Especially because SOPA targets foreign non-US websites that host links to US content (US TV appearances). And the "we're fans and only want to watch it" reply to them won't be listened to. Of course the thing on this sites side is a good relationship with the band. As in, you'd hope you could talk to your band contacts and work out solutions and they'd help in the process. If the need arises. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busybeeburns Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Filesonic are getting twitchy. http://www.prefixmag.com/news/filesonic-disables-file-sharing/60803/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Italian Plastic Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I use Mediafire legally more than I do illegally. Would suck to see it get taken down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coeurli Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Filesonic are getting twitchy. http://www.prefixmag.com/news/filesonic-disables-file-sharing/60803/ Nononononononooooooo.....OMG, one by one, they're all gonna disappear :worried2: I'm seriously worried about the MM section now....:worried2: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
getithom Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I use Mediafire legally more than I do illegally. Would suck to see it get taken down. Agreed. I wonder what site goes down next? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busybeeburns Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Cyberlocker Ecosystem Shocked As Big Players Take Drastic Action In the wake of last week’s Megaupload shutdown, some of the biggest names in the market are taking drastic action. During the last 48 hours many sites have completely withdrawn their systems for paying uploaders when their files are shared with others, but one of the most dramatic moves came first from Filesonic and today Fileserve. Both services now forbid people from downloading any files they didn’t upload themselves. While the shutdown last week of Megaupload and the arrest of its founder and management team was certainly dramatic, a situation of perhaps even greater gravity is beginning to emerge. Over the past 48 to 72 hours, the operators of many prominent cyberlocker services have been taking unprecedented actions that can not simply be explained away by mere coincidence. The details in the Megaupload indictment clearly have some players in the file-hosting world spooked. One of the key allegations is that between 2005 and mid 2011, Megaupload ran a program that rewarded users for uploading infringing material. A cited internal email allegedly shows staff members discussing cash payments going to people uploading “full popular DVD rips” and “software with keygenerators (Warez)”. Although Megaupload stopped paying out rewards in July 2011, that didn’t stop the site from getting raided. Other cyberlocker services are clearly hoping they will be more lucky. Last evening Filesonic, a top 10 player in the file-sharing world with a billion pageviews a month, not only withdrew its affiliate rewards program, but also banned any third parties downloading files. Simply put, users can now only download files from the service that they uploaded themselves. But according to reports, there’s no guarantee of that. Account owners report that their files are being mass deleted, that’s if their entire account has been banned already. Fileserve, another leading player, also ended its affiliate program this weekend. Additionally, this morning TorrentFreak received news that Fileserve has now joined Filesonic in banning all 3rd party downloads. “I just paid for a premium account and can now only download my own fucking files an unlimited number of times,” said one angry user. “What use is that?” Other users of Fileserve are experiencing an even further degraded level of service. Reports describe mass deletion of their uploads and the banning of accounts on apparent ‘Terms of Service’ violations. But the changes at these two services appears to be just the tip of a very big and very complex iceberg. Developments at other file-hosting services are widespread. As previously reported, Uploaded.to banned all US IP addresses in what appears to be an effort to distance itself from US jurisdiction. Its affiliate program is still listed as operational but the same cannot be said about those run by some of its competitors. VideoBB and VideoZer have both reportedly closed their rewards program and according to reports have also been mass deleting accounts and huge numbers of files. Other sites closing their affiliate programs and/or deleting accounts/files include FileJungle, UploadStation and FilePost. Another interesting development involves so-called ‘release blogs’, sites that report on leaked material but either provide links to the material on cyberlockers or allow their users to do the same. The number of overall releases hasn’t changed much but the links currently being posted on some of these sites show less variety and volume than they did this time last week. Update: Smaller host UploadBox calls it quits. “All files will be deleted on January 30th. Feel free to download the files you store with UploadBox until this date.” Update2: Another host, x7.to, shuts down. Update 3: TorrentFreak has seen evidence that on request PayPal is refunding cash paid to Filesonic over the weekend. Update 4: FileJungle and UploadStation have disabled all 3rd party downloads. Update 5: 4shared cancels affiilate program. http://torrentfreak.com/cyberlocker-ecosystem-shocked-as-big-players-take-drastic-action-120123/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coeurli Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 nonononononoooooooo :worried2::worried2: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saffire Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I wonder how many jobs were destroyed because of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Italian Plastic Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 this is awful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheese Nip 2 Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I better go download everything in the Multimedia section....like now.:confused: Edit: Wait, are these American sites? I know it's an American law, but will other countries lose out too? In other words, can you still use filesonic over in Europe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Italian Plastic Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 They're american sites but they'll be shut down for the whole world (I'm in NZ and can't use FS) also, this is interesting. (wish it had proper figures, but it's pretty accurate) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiame Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I better go download everything in the Multimedia section....like now.:confused: Edit: Wait, are these American sites? I know it's an American law, but will other countries lose out too? In other words, can you still use filesonic over in Europe? Nope. It's actually got less to do with the USA and more to do with the profit that media companies make. They want more profit everywhere - so they shut down websites and prevent them from operating everywhere. They do this by targeting US operated sites so the owners themselves can't continue to run the site. That's what is so annoying about the whole issues - these corporations are using the US government to make decisions internally, when in reality it effects everyone outside of the US too. But don't worry about PIPA. ACTA is far worse and that is an international legislation that most of Europe are getting ready to sign. In short: We're fucked unless people keep reacting like they did to SOPA. That's our only chance. If people start to simmer down and get over it then they'll strike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saffire Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Possibly the real reason MegaUpload was shut down: http://www.digitalmusicnews.com/permalink/2011/111221airvinyl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busybeeburns Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 just coming to post this... I read it somewhere else too... Why was MegaUpload really shut down? In December of 2011, just weeks before the takedown, Digital Music News reported on something new that the creators of #Megaupload were about to unroll. Something that would rock the music industry to its core. (http://goo.gl/A7wUZ) I present to you... MegaBox. MegaBox was going to be an alternative music store that was entirely cloud-based and offered artists a better money-making opportunity than they would get with any record label. "UMG knows that we are going to compete with them via our own music venture called Megabox.com, a site that will soon allow artists to sell their creations directly to consumers while allowing artists to keep 90 percent of earnings," MegaUpload founder Kim 'Dotcom' Schmitz told Torrentfreak Not only did they plan on allowing artists to keep 90% of their earnings on songs that they sold, they wanted to pay them for songs they let users download for free. "We have a solution called the Megakey that will allow artists to earn income from users who download music for free," Dotcom outlined. "Yes that's right, we will pay artists even for free downloads. The Megakey business model has been tested with over a million users and it works." https://plus.google.com/u/0/111314089359991626869/posts/HQJxDRiwAWq Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coeurli Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 ^ :shocked3: ouuuh interesting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busybeeburns Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Here's a commentary [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8R-IXyigeCI]#MEGABOX - The Real Reason #MEGAUPLOAD Was Taken Down?! - YouTube[/ame] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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