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Postcards From Far Away project | Previous pre-delivery discussion (thread closed)


Lore

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can someone just redirect me to where my old first post is, then? i'd still like to fix it.

 

 

i know that lore didn't delete what i was working on, i think it was a glitch with the site, but all my edits to the old first post in the old active are now gone, and i can't even find the original post.

 

if you ask me, i think the threads should be unmerged and i'll fix what i said i would, but i know i don't have decision-making power. however, BOTH threads were off topic, and now we have one, huge, confusing off topic thread instead of two smaller ones, one of which i can fix to be better. i just think we're overreacting to the off-topicness, since every thread gets off-topic.

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redirect is done. Directs to this one for now.

 

The first post in the doomed thread will be in here somewhere, but it would have been planted into it in date order. If you can remember the date or keywords you can search for it and then add it to the first post :)

 

Unmerging will be difficult and is best done manually, however the old thread link (i.e. showthread.php?t=50583) is lost. It will have to be a new link. :)

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ok, well at least the redirect problem was fixed, but this is still a complete mess in my opinion. i'm not saying all this to get MY thread back or whatever--that's not what i care about. i care about the clarity of the first post and the title, and consistency with what people are used to. everyone's going to be thrown off now because the title and the first post are different, and there was a huge jump in number of pages and number of posts with the merge, and people aren't going to be able to identify the thread anymore and are going to go digging to find the old one they're used to and come up fruitless.

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Woah, hang on. What just happened?

 

I came on here just now, checked the first post. And that nice and carefully organised post by Chelsea is gone. And now its looks messy. Any way of undoing that? or at least copying and pasting what was originally in the first post so that it looks proffesional again?

 

And i've read the past few pages, and frankly i think the whole merging this was totally unnecessary. Whether or not people were being off topic, merging the threads just made things a whole bunch worse and more confusing than it ever was. Can someone tell me why we didn't make a JOINT DECISION on merging these threads?

 

Seriously, this is such a shame. I know its tempting to use modding abilities just because you have them, but this was definitely the wrong move. It might be too much to ask, but i think the threads should be unmerged, for simplicity's sake. Dear me, though.

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I asked for keep the thread on topic, but even in the first post chelsea was encouraging the off topic :(
Why did you have to merge it with that other old thread though? I don't understand.

 

Oh, and another thing. The rules and stuff in the first post now are ANCIENT. They're the ones from like, November... where did all the new ones go? The ones that Chelsea wrote?

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Don't worry! Unmerge is not a feature of vBulletin, but if you want two threads again may I suggest that the posts from the deleted thread be found from this thread and highlighted by a moderator and moved into a new thread :)

 

Again, nothing has been deleted so its possible to fix everything :)

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Don't worry! Unmerge is not a feature of vBulletin, but if you want two threads again may I suggest that the posts from the deleted thread be found from this thread and highlighted by a moderator and moved into a new thread :)

 

Again, nothing has been deleted so its possible to fix everything :)

 

so basically, if someone wants to wade their way through all 200 odd pages to let us know which posts were from which thread we can pull them out into separate threads again? :confused:

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because the thread was created to keep it clear and easy to read but it wasn't like that anymore, so having two threads about the same topic wasn't necessary anymore

But you merging them didn't make it any easier or clearer to read. Thats my point. At least, please find Chelsea's first post and put it back where it belongs? It's the least you can do, I think.

 

And undoing this mess manually sounds like a bitch to me, so I know that's probably not going to happen. But the thread is now longer and more confusing than ever, and I just wish it was discussed beforehand so we could determine whether it actually needed to be merged. Which it didn't, frankly.

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Lastest Updates:

 

February 11

 

 

January 29

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

__________________________________________________________________________

Flash: http://megaswf.com/view/912d20582bbfc3177e1c1365bbbfc30a.html

 

Banners: coldplayingpostcardsbaneq2.jpgcoldplayingpostcardsbanuc5.jpg

 

Wallpaper:

 

 

 

Guidelines and rules: http://www.coldplaying.com/postcards (Thanks Ian!)

Link to logos thread: http://www.coldplaying.com/forum/showthread.php?t=50556

 

 

What's this about?

We'll send postcards to the band from all over the world!(the project was inspired by the song Postcards From Far Away). The project is a way to say thanks to the band for this amazing year!

 

How many postcards are allowed per person?

You can send them one or two postcards. It wouldn't be good if they see 10 postcards from the same person, they would think that the project it's from just a few of us

 

delivery method?

We'll send the postcards to a PO Box (we'll post the address soon), and then Debs, from coldplay.com will give the postcards to the band!

 

deadline?

not defined yet

 

postcard template

you can buy a nice postcard with a pic of your country or maybe make your own postcard...

 

in case that you want to create your own postcard but you need a template for the back side, here's some templatesTEMPLATE:

 

postcardback4x6noprevieyz6.jpg

 

If you want to PRINT this, download the FULL RESOLUTION version here:

http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/7...x6copy2ek4.jpg

 

-OR-

 

postcardback4x6previewwh9.jpg

 

If you want to PRINT this, download the FULL RESOLUTION version here:

http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/6...4x6copyfj6.jpg

 

we'll send a letter to the band to tell them what it's all about

 

we have a draft of the letter, Chelsea wrote it

 

 

Dear Guy, Jonny, Will, and Chris,

 

As multilingual, multinational members of the fansite coldplaying.com, several of us got together one night to think of how we could express our thanks to you for giving us the best music we have ever heard and for making 2008 the best year to date in Coldplay history. Of course, there is no way we could thank you enough for all that you have given us throughout the years: the music, the concerts, your innate senses of humor, your constant attention to your fans, the international causes to care for, and upstanding people to look up to and emulate. Each person’s reason for being a Coldplay fan is unique and personal and cannot be covered with broad, blanket statements in a letter such as this one. This is why we’ve decided to organize ourselves into a mass-movement of postcard-sending: for each coldplaying.com member to personally say thank you for everything you have done and the lives you have touched and changed throughout the years. Thus, the Postcards From Far Away Project was born.

Many of us live very far away from your home base of England, while others of us live practically in your backyard. Wherever Coldplay fans live and whatever languages they speak, something every one of us could do was drop a postcard in the post with a short message in any language expressing our thanks for everything you have given us and your undying attention and generosity in 2008 in particular. We assume that you get bagfuls of mail every day, but we hoped that under the umbrella of a united project, our short messages of thanks from every corner of the globe would take on a greater meaning and express how much your music and your actions have meant to us throughout the years in a bigger way. At the least, we hope you’re aware of a tidal wave of increase in your fan mail, and at the most, we hope you’re able to read some of them and take their notes to heart.

Our Project is a small effort to give back in a small way for all that you have given us, especially this year. No matter how many thousands of postcards we could send in, you have given us the greater gift of your music and by spoiling us rotten in 2008 with practically two albums of new material, a regularly and personally updated website, touring the world over, and still having the time to sign autographs and take photo after photo with the fans who wait for you outside hotels and concert venues. We’d also like to extend our heartfelt thanks to your crew and management, in particular Roadie #42, the Oracle, Prospekt, Anchorman, and Debs. We are all very glad that we were rabid Coldplay fans in 2008, because no other band could have given us the amount of attention and information that you gave, and no other band would have kept us in such anticipation.

 

 

 

Chelsea also wrote some rules, we'll update this

 

 

1.Mail a postcard no bigger than 10x15 cms (4x6 inches) to [iNSERT ADDRESS HERE] by [WHATEVER DATE].

Keeping postcards relatively the same size ensures that they all will be given the same attention upon first look, and reminds the band or whoever collects the postcards that these are part of a united project, making their meaning stronger. You can buy a postcard, like a regular travel postcard from where you live, or you can make a personalized one in any way you wish. Travel postcards remind the band of our internationality; personalized postcards remind the band of our dedication and thanks.

 

2.Write a personal message of thanks to the band.

It’s probably best to keep the message short and sweet, yet heartfelt and true. It can be written in any language and say whatever you’d like, personal or generic. It would be nice to say something like “Merry/Happy Christmas” or “Happy Holidays” too, since we’re aiming for the bulk of these cards to get them by Christmas.

 

3.Include the official “Postcards from Far Away Project” seal on the card somewhere. [iNSERT SEAL]

Including this seal reinforces the notion of a united project, which will probably make the cards more meaningful to the band as a whole. If you can’t print out this seal and paste it on, please at least write “POSTCARDS FROM FAR AWAY PROJECT” in some obvious place.

 

4.Be sure to say where the postcard is sent from!

We think the band would like to know where each card is sent from, and it would emphasize their global fanbase. Usually, postcards don’t have a place to write a return address, but writing “SENT FROM [your city and country]” would probably increase the meaning of the notes.

 

 

This project isn’t looking to get anything back, like signed photos or albums. It’s all about thanking the band for all they’ve already given us, this year in particular, and saying “happy holidays.” We assume that because you’re a member of this site, you’re a big Coldplay fan and wouldn’t be too embarrassed or feel too stupid sending in a couple sentences of thanks. For this project, the more is DEFINITELY the merrier, and we’d love to send in hundreds of cards (thousands might be too optimistic, but we’d love to get there too!).

This is no where near as neat and tidy as it was beforehand.

 

And it's COMPLETELY out of date, apart from the first two sentences at the top. :sad:

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i'll fix the note in the first post if you want me to, lore. you could have asked me that all along. i wasn't even aware until today that you were this adamant about the offtopicness. i think you're taking it too seriously, but you could have ASKED me to remove that or ASKED me to make things more clear before you made a rash decision in merging the threads and starting all this.

 

i know you're probably not going to listen to me because you're mad at me, ian too, but i think the threads should be unmerged to their original states. then i'll fix the first post and we'll implement a new no-off-topic policy so everything will ONLY be postcards related from thereon in, especially since it's getting to be the date soon. i'll make a new jaffa cake thread in the lounge if you want, and all will be back to normal and clear, unlike it is now.

 

i'm sorry i made the jaffa cakes reference in that post, but people are just having fun with the jaffa cake talk. what else are we going to do while we wait? if you really feel THAT strongly about it, we can make the thread rules stricter from here on in, but i really think the threads should be unmerged for the sake of the project and clarity, and not for any other reason. i'll make any edits you want me to to keep people from whining and fights like this from breaking out.

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i'd also be willing to wade through and find where the two threads meet, and to do some grunt work if no one else is willing to do it. then i can tell an admin/mod so it's easier on them. i just think this needs to be done for clarity's sake, especially since we need everything to be sorted and clear by MONDAY. i think this was a bad time to make a drastic change in the way things run.

 

i should shut up, but this is really irking me that it wasn't a joint decision to make any change--it just happened.

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**WE WILL BE RECEIVING AN UPDATE FROM DEBS ON MONDAY, FEBRUARY 16,2009!!!**

 

I know I should have been doing this all along, but here are Debs's most important and currently relevant posts (newest to oldest):

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

These are the rules and guidelines for participating in the Postcards from Far Away Project.

 

The bulk of the postcards should have been sent by now, as the intended last day for sending was MONDAY, DECEMBER 22. However, if you have created a postcard you may still send it, but please be aware that the card may not arrive in time for Debs to deliver to Coldplay in early January with all the others, depending on where you live. Since the address is now the permanent fanmail address, your cards will be recieved, but they may or may not make it to Debs in time for her to drop them off in early January. Since we don't know exactly what day in early January Debs plans to deliver the cards, try to have your cards arrive in the UK in the first week of January (I'm an early bird and a worry wart, so I would say try to have them in the UK by January 1!). Get your asses moving, procrastinators!

 

If you still have to send your card, get it in the mail AS SOON AS POSSIBLE.

If you live in Asia, Australia, South/Central America, or Africa, your cards really need to be in the mail by the 25th at the latest for them to arrive in time to be part of the big drop-off (though I think if you haven't mailed it yet, it might not arrive in time anyway :\). Mail between North America and the UK tends to move slightly faster, and mail usually arrives in a week or so. If you live in Europe or especially the UK, also get your cards in the mail as soon as possible, but you have slightly more time to play with if you're looking to get in with the mass-drop-off. Because I worry, I would say still try to have your cards in Debs's PO Box by January 1, but lots of people are going to think that's too early :P. Please PM ApproximatelyInfinite with questions, or ask in this thread.

 

ADDRESS:

COLDPLAY

P.O. Box 246

Cheadle

SK8 9AF

UK

 

 

For the Project, please send unenveloped postcards only.

Debs has said that this PO box address will become THE mailing address for the band and any mail will be accepted there (though NOT packages containing gifts--those will be donated to charity). However, this project is intended for individual POSTCARDS containing short messages of thanks. If you wish to write a longer letter to the guys, please send it separately from the postcards, unaffiliated to the project (though Debs has said there will not be any personal replies). We'd really appreciate it if this project consisted only of postcards, to keep in reference to the song :D

(If you have any questions about the use of envelopes, please PM ApproximatelyInfinite).

 

WHAT ELSE YOU CAN DO:

-TAKE PHOTOS/SCANS of your card(s) for everyone to see and post them in THIS thread!

-If you're a procrastinator, MAIL YOUR DAMN CARD ALREADY! :P

-PM questions to Lore or ApproximatelyInfinite (Chelsea), or ask in this thread.

 

OFFICIAL LOGO:

 

(All art by Semy [Zemy101]) :dance:

logonstamptinyhx5.png

Download the high-resolution version HERE, or see the other variations HERE.

 

 

 

 

TEMPLATES:

 

 

 

postcardback4x6noprevieyz6.jpg

 

If you want to PRINT this, download the FULL RESOLUTION version here:

http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/7796/postcardback4x6copy2ek4.jpg

 

-OR-

 

postcardback4x6previewwh9.jpg

 

If you want to PRINT this, download the FULL RESOLUTION version here:

http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/6523/postcardback4x6copyfj6.jpg

 

 

 

SEMY'S GRAPICS:

 

 

 

Flash animation:

[postcards]http://www.imgir.com/images/e9w1gku79x9eehjnlz.swf[/postcards]

 

TO EMBED IN YOUR SIG: Copy and paste the following text in green, and delete the space before the last bracket :wink:

[postcards]http://www.imgir.com/images/e9w1gku79x9eehjnlz.swf[/postcards ]

 

Banner:

coldplayingpostcardsbaneq2.jpg

 

 

Wallpaper:

 

 

postcardsbackground2copkb4.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

GENERAL RULES FOR CARDS:

 

 

1. Only mail TWO POSTCARDS, approximately 10.2X15.2 cms (4X6 inches).

Do NOT use envelopes. PM ApproximatelyInfinite with questions.

 

2. Include the official "Postcards from Far Away Project" LOGO somewhere on the card by printing it out and pasting it on.

 

3. TEMPLATES are completely optional, but encouraged (and the logo is already on them).

 

4. Mail your postcards to Debs's P.O. Box (at the beginning of this post) BY AIRMAIL by DECEMBER 22, 2008.

Earlier is always better! Best get it in the mail NOW to ensure Debs has it in hand by the time she gives the cards to the guys in early January.

 

 

 

STEPS FOR SENDING CARDS:

 

 

1.Find or make one or two postcards measuring approximately 10.2x15.2 cms (4x6 inches), which is the maximum postcard size allowed to be sent for postcard rates.

Keeping postcards relatively the same size ensures that they all will be given the same attention upon first look, and reminds the band and Debs that these are part of a united project, making their meaning stronger. You can buy a postcard, like a regular travel postcard from where you live, or you can make a personalized one in any way you wish (though please make sure the homemade postcards are printed/created on thick paper, like cardstock, rather than just regular printer paper). Travel postcards remind the band of our internationality; personalized postcards remind the band of our dedication and thanks. Sending two is great, but do not go over sending two. Imagine how it would look to Coldplay or their management if they keep picking up postcards from the same person and location over and over. We’d like to make this as global as possible, rather than having one person get more noticeable just because they have the time and money to send in 100 cards.

 

2.Write a personal message of thanks to the band.

It’s probably best to keep the message short and sweet, yet heartfelt and true. It can be written in any language and say whatever you’d like, personal or generic. We think that if our plan works and they actually get to read some of these, it would mean more to them to have a few lines about a personal Coldplay experience you had, such as how a particular song helped you through a hard time. It would also be nice to say something like “Merry/Happy Christmas” or “Happy Holidays” too, since we’re aiming for these cards to get them by Christmas. Try to address the cards to Coldplay as a whole, or “Coldplay and Crew” rather than an individual band member, since this project is about generally thanking them rather than saying you have the hots for Guy or Jonny.

On the half of the postcard designated for the address, please write this:

COLDPLAY

P.O. Box 246

Cheadle

SK8 9AF

UK

 

 

Debs has set up a P.O. box for us where all the cards will be mailed, so this is where she will collect the postcards before delivering them to the band.

However, do not put your return address on the card. There is limited room on postcards as it is, and postcards usually don't allow space for return addresses. If you put on your home address as well as Debs's P.O. Box, the post office may get confused about which address to send the card to and either hold it for a long time at the post office or at worst, send it back to you.

 

3.Include the official “Postcards from Far Away Project” LOGO on the card somewhere, or use a given template.

Including this seal or the template reinforces the notion of a united project, which will probably make the cards more meaningful to the band as a whole. If you can’t print out this seal and paste it on, please at least write “POSTCARDS FROM FAR AWAY PROJECT” in some obvious place. The templates are completely optional and not required, but provide an easy way to write your postcards and show what we are aiming for all the cards to look like, more or less.

We're not going to be strict about which logo you use, since they're all beautiful and all get the point across. We still voted on ONE to use in official venues so the project can be associated with a logo on the coverletter etc, and it would be nice to use the "official" one to enforce the unity of the project, but really, you can use whichever logo you'd like that's posted in the thread.

 

4.Be sure to say where the postcard is sent from!

We think the band would like to know where each card is sent from, and it would emphasize their global fanbase. Usually, postcards don’t have a place to write a return address, but writing “SENT FROM [your city and country]” would probably increase the meaning of the notes.

 

5.Scan or take a photo of your postcard before sending it off and post it here on Coldplaying!

We’d love to see everyone’s cards, especially the handmade ones. We know that most people will put tons of effort into them, and it’ll be even more fun to share them all with each other. THIS is the thread to post your photos/scans of your card(s) in.

 

6.Go to your local post office to obtain the correct amount of postage for mailing your postcard(s) to England [Not applicable to UK residents].

Don’t just slap some stamps onto the cards and throw them in the mail. International mail rates change depending on the weight of the item and distance from destination, and it is best to be sure that you have the correct amount to ensure delivery and timeliness. Please send your postcards by AIRMAIL and that you receive and attach the appropriate stickers at the post office. If you don’t send the cards by airmail, they will probably be sent by sea and will arrive weeks or even months too late! Check THIS link to see how long regular mail takes versus airmail--airmail really is the only way we can go. The post office will then mail your postcards from there. If there is NO possible way that you can get to a post office whatsoever, write AIRMAIL in an obvious place at the top of the card and put on several MORE stamps than you think would be required to get your cards to England; perhaps your currency’s equivalent of two US dollars worth of postage to be safe.

Also, DO NOT PUT YOUR POSTCARDS IN ENVELOPES. Envelopes are more expensive to send and there is too much temptation to enclose other things inside the envelopes that make the cards seem less equal and less united. If you are sending two cards, send each one separately. There is no need to use an envelope anyway--the cards will get there the same without them :D. If you have questions about this, or your country REQUIRES the use of envelopes, PM ApproximatelyInfinite.

 

This project isn’t looking to get anything back, like signed photos or albums. It’s all about thanking the band and crew/team for all they’ve already given us, this year in particular, and saying “happy holidays.” We assume that because you’re a member of this site, you’re a big Coldplay fan and wouldn’t be too embarrassed or feel too stupid sending in a couple sentences of thanks. For this project, the more participants is DEFINITELY the merrier, and we’d love to send in hundreds of cards (thousands might be too optimistic, but we’d love to get there too!).

 

If you follow these rules, mail your cards as soon as we get the address, and put your faith into the international postal service, everything should go to plan and if we’re lucky, Coldplay will receive all our postcards and hopefully will read them!

 

Any questions can be directed to Lore or ApproximatelyInfinite (Chelsea) in a PM. The more postcards the merrier, and we believe the more Coldplay will be touched by our efforts.

 

Thank you all so much for your ideas, help, enthusiasm, and participation. We hope that the sheer number of cards will be just as touching to the band as the messages they contain, and we couldn’t have organized any of this without all of you. Now, get creating, writing, and mailing!

 

 

 

OTHER HELPFUL BITS OF INFORMATION/INSTRUCTIONS:

 

 

WHERE TO BUY POSTCARDS:

This can be tricky. At least in America, where I'm from, postcards are hard to find outside of big cities and touristy places. Neither my hometown or uni town have postcards, so I'm making both of mine. If you can find some somewhere, by all means use them (it might be worth asking your post office if they know where you can buy some). Otherwise, I would say it's better to make your own, and more fun!

 

TO PRINT YOUR OWN POSTCARDS OR THE TEMPLATES:

If they're not the correct size already, resize the templates to 4X6 inches (10.2X15.2 cms) using programs like Paint or Photoshop etc. You can print your postcards/templates out on ANY card of that size that is thicker than regular printer paper. It's easiest to print them out on cheap 4X6 inch index cards. Set your printer to print on paper of that size, make sure you select "fit photo to frame" (or other similar option), use the best quality setting on your printer, and voila.

 

TO USE THE LOGO:

You can print out the logo in any size you would like, or any size that would fit. Put it wherever it fits (but NOT where the stamps go and NOT where the address goes), on whatever side you want. You can use whatever logo in the thread you would like, really, but we *suggest* you use the official one at the beginning of this post. Some of the logos are very large and/or detailed and need to be resized to use, so bear that in mind.

 

TO KNOW WHEN TO SEND YOUR CARD BY:

MAIL ALL CARDS BY DECEMBER 22, 2008. Debs will give the cards to the guys in early January, so make sure your cards are in the mail by December to allow a few weeks for delivery.

Check THIS link under "Last Posting Dates - International Airmail (Delivery estimate 10-14 days)." However, EARLIER IS ALWAYS BETTER. IF YOU DON'T SEND YOUR CARDS BY AIRMAIL, THEY WON'T ARRIVE IN TIME.

The dates in this link actually apply to sending international mail FROM the UK, not TO the UK, but they are still good guidelines to stick to.

 

DO NOT PUT YOUR CARDS IN AN ENVELOPE.

Even if you're sending two cards, please send them each separately. If you're sending one card, please DON'T put it in an envelope. Enveloped mail is more expensive to send anyway, and postcards don't require envelopes anyway--they'll get there perfectly fine without envelopes. Also, if people use envelopes, there will be a temptation to enclose other things, such as a longer letter or more artwork or something like that. This project is about everyone having the same amount of space to express themselves artistically, and then the same amount of space to express themselves verbally (in a concise way). It becomes unfair once people start using envelopes, and it seems like less of a united project. Besides, it's called POSTCARDS from far away, not LETTERS from far away :D.

If you have any questions regarding this, or your country REQUIRES the use of envelopes, please PM ApproximatelyInfinite.

 

DO NOT PUT YOUR RETURN ADDRESS ON THE CARD.

There is limited room on postcards as it is, and postcards usually don't allow space for return addresses. If you put on your home address as well as Debs's P.O. Box, the post office may get confused about which address to send the card to and either hold it for a long time at the post office or at worst, send it back to you.

 

 

 

 

 

THIS THREAD IS ONLY FOR QUESTIONS REGARDING THE PROJECT. Please post all your suggestions and comments HERE. (Pffft, well we broke that rule long ago :lol:. Carry on, Jaffa Cake lovers! :D)

I found it, thank GOD.

 

Now can someone put this back into the first post? pretty please? :D

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I'm not mad at you, it's just that I saw some complains about the off topic posts and then it made me realize that it was really hard to keep everything clear, and when I posted that there was too much off topic here no one replied at it... the bad thing is that you, as the creator of the thread, instead of trying to help to keep a clean thread, you just encouraged people to post about it, even in the first post :(, also I posted that if you wanted to keep the food talk you could create a thread in the lounge, but one listened to it

 

 

i should shut up, but this is really irking me that it wasn't a joint decision to make any change--it just happened.

 

it wasn't a joint decision to encourage the off topic posts in the first post of the therad neither

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:cheesy:

 

thank you for finding it :kiss:

 

my edits on it were deleted, though i know that's some glitch's fault. i STILL think the threads should be unmerged (i'll do the grunt work and report back to a mod), but it would help at least if that was changed to the first post.

 

lore, than you should have TOLD me that. if you saw i didn't see it in the thread, you could have PMed me or IMed me, not just taken everything into your own hands. and i'm not talking about just checking with ME, i'm talking about you checking with EVERYONE, seeing if people agreed. we could have tried harder to control the offtopicness, but no one really seemed to mind it. if it bothered you that much, you should have tried harder to get it fixed before changing everything.

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