The States are so patriotic it gets scarry :(

 

Yup, there are plenty of people returning from Iraq and Afghanistan battle-scarred.:dozey:

Congrats to the kid. Fortunately we don't have to do such idiotic things in school.

I saw this on the news like a couple of weeks ago... For an Arkansan, he's got his head on straight, this kid! Proud of him!! Woop! Woop!

Old news, and yea this kid is my hero. Fuck the pledge.

The States are so patriotic it gets scarry :(

 

You can say that again! What other country goes down to the finest details in it's constitution! Right to bear arms??! I personally prefer not to shave mine.

You can say that again! What other country goes down to the finest details in it's constitution! Right to bear arms??! I personally prefer not to shave mine.

 

^That made me laugh so much. Do you know what you did there?

oh I almost forgot

 

http://arkansasnews.com/2009/10/15/hey-kid-youd-better-make-that-pledge/

Rather than say “one nation under God, indivisible,” he could say, “one nation, not subject to anyone’s forced religion, and where the right-wing Texas governor was free even to intimate his state’s secession.”

Rather than say “with liberty and justice for all,” he could say, “with liberty and justice for many people, but, sadly as yet, not gays or lesbians.”

That ought to satisfy everybody.

 

 

 

WIN

 

 

 

At my swim meet yesterday I sat down and drank Powerade during the National Anthem and at least 5 people shot me dirty looks, I counted.

EPIC WIN

 

 

Yup, there are plenty of people returning from Iraq and Afghanistan battle-scarred.:dozey:

Nice Mark, make fun of our troops overseas. Real classy.

:rolleyes::laugh3: Bear arms and legs! Or Arm Bears. Or something like that..:P

I think though it's not the pledge that's wrong, it's forcing everyone to say it as an indoctrination. Also, if we look at our basic cherished values (speaking as Sam, the American Eagle Here from the Muppets), the values we hold dear are the natural rights of all humans, regardless of their place on the planet.

Let's take a look at that basic pledge: "We pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America. One nation, under God, indivisible, with Liberty and Justice for all"

I see the problems as well. We should be pledging allegiance (if we so choose) to the principles of liberty and justice, and to our nation as a protector of those principles. One nation - that's fine, and the indivisible part makes us all feel united (recalling the states' squabbles), but the 'Under God' part was added more recently - I think during WWII. I think the 'Under God' part would be better left off as in the original version. But that would be like trying to change rail sizes for the trains we have, so it would be mighty contentious to do so..

Anyhow, good for the young man to stand up and assert his right to choose!! Freedom of speech also means having the right to not speak, if one so chooses. And forced recitals of oaths is akin to totalitarian thinking - good point!

Yes, I understand Spain's hardships during Franco - hard to believe it went on so long! Glad you're free!!

 

PS - Bryce, what's the nicene creed?

 

PS - Bryce, what's the nicene creed?

its a statement of what Christians believe used by some denominations.

its a statement of what Christians believe used by some denominations.

 

We believe in one God,

the Father, the Almighty,

of all that is, seen and unseen.

 

 

We believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ,

the only Son of God,

eternally begotten of the Father,

God from God, Light from Light,

true God from true God,

begotten, not made,

of one Being with the Father.

 

Through him all things were made.

 

For us and for our salvation

he came down from heaven:

by the power of the Holy Spirit

he became incarnate from the Virgin Mary,

and was made man.

 

For our sake he was crucified under Pontius Pilate;

he suffered death and was buried.

 

On the third day he rose again

in accordance with the Scriptures;

he ascended into heaven

and is seated at the right hand of the Father.

 

He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead,

and his kingdom will have no end.

 

We believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life,

who proceeds from the Father and the Son.

 

With the Father and the Son he is worshipped and glorified.

 

He has spoken through the Prophets.

 

We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church.

 

We acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.

 

We look for the resurrection of the dead,

and the life of the world to come. Amen.

Thanks Bryce! I think I have heard the nicene creed a long, long time ago - but it's good to be refreshed!

I'll have to do some searching for Sam (one moment please..)

And I am here to present to you tonight Sam, the American Eagle. Here to explain what good wholesome patriotic American family entertainment is![ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBuDGHd2Qkg&NR=1]YouTube - Sam the Eagle meets Zero Mostel[/ame][ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wYUBnHuYm5U&feature=related]YouTube - The Muppet Show - Interview with William Shakespeare[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCVmKN5At_o&NR=1]YouTube - Sam the Eagle[/ame]

^ :laugh3:

^^ MUPPET WIN.

At my swim meet yesterday I sat down and drank Powerade during the National Anthem and at least 5 people shot me dirty looks, I counted.

 

 

 

This made me remember of our flag ceremonies when I was in highschool. The elementary pupils sang the Nat'l Anthem at the top of their lungs, and we, were just dead silent.

 

Those 'people' who had been observing our behaviour didn't even bother to sing with us.

I don't like the American anthem :angry:

We talked about this event the entire english class today... :thinking:

I don't say the pledge, (I'm in High School) and my global teacher, who i happen to have for homeroom, holds it against me. She has made references to her assumption that I must be a communist and asked me if I'd "Like to go live in communist China". I didn't get a chance to respond, but if i could've, I woul've said "No, I wouldn't, that's exactly why I'm not saying it. In the United States I have a right to not say the pledge. In China, I wouldn't. " I can't stand watching everyone recite this propaganda day after day like a bunch of clones.

We talked about this event the entire english class today... :thinking:

English class. mhm.

We have to sing the national anthem at the beginning of assemblies, that's all.

I saw the interview with the kid. He's got balls. I'd high five him if I could.

^ Where can I see? :wtf:

English class. mhm.

Yes, English class... :uhoh:

Our English teacher told us to rewrite the pledge. He started asking us what the pledge meant to us, why we say it, stuff like that.

We then started talking about how the that boy didn't say it. Most of the class found it disrespectful, and I was shocked, really. :shocked2:

 

Who said that you don't respect our Republic or goverment if we don't say it? You could just disagree with certain parts of it...

 

In the pledge a part says "Under god,". I am not saying that I don't beleive in God, but, why would another person who doesn't beleive in God honor something they don't beleive in? I thought people came to this country for freedom of religion!

 

My own English Teacher says the entire pledge except the "Under God," Part because he doesn't want to pressure his students who don't beleive in God, to start to just because the pleade refers to it.

 

Please, no one kill me, I am not trying offend or anyone on cause an argument... :uhoh::sick:

 

edit: If any of my information seems wrong, please feel free to correct me.

 

In the pledge a part says "Under god,". I am not saying that I don't beleive in God, but, why would another person who doesn't beleive in God (those who are Jewish, for example), honor something they don't beleive in? I thought people came to this country for freedom of religion!

 

You are stupid bitch, Jewish people definitely believe in a god

Yes, English class... :uhoh:

Our English teacher told us to rewrite the pledge. He started asking us what the pledge meant to us, why we say it, stuff like that.

We then started talking about how the that boy didn't say it. Most of the class found it disrespectful, and I was shocked, really. :shocked2:

 

Who said that you don't respect our Republic or goverment if we don't say it? You could just disagree with certain parts of it...

 

In the pledge a part says "Under god,". I am not saying that I don't beleive in God, but, why would another person who doesn't beleive in God (those who are Jewish, for example), honor something they don't beleive in? I thought people came to this country for freedom of religion!

 

My own English Teacher says the entire pledge except the "Under God," Part because he doesn't want to pressure his students who don't beleive in God, to start to just because the pleade refers to it.

 

Please, no one kill me, I am not trying offend or anyone on cause an argument... :uhoh::sick:

 

edit: If any of my information seems wrong, please feel free to correct me. :nice:

 

Stargirl, although I am not Jewish so I can't say 100% for sure, I think they believe in God, but they don't believe the whole Jesus resurrection thing. (Hopefully I didn't offend anyone here, that isn't my intent.)

 

In any event, back to the topic... I remember in elementary school, which was about 20 years ago for me (eek, that makes me feel so old to say that), at one point we stopped saying the pledge exactly for that reason. That was when the whole "under God" debate started, so the school elected to stop saying the pledge until it was resolved. I'm not sure when/if the school reinstated it.

 

To force kids to pledge to the flag is a bit rediculous anyway, I think. It doesn't really do much good, since most adults don't even know the "rules" when it comes to the flag (which are a bit silly too). Did you know it is a "rule" that you can't let the flag touch the ground, it is a sign of disrespect? In addition to letting it fly tattered, letting it fly at night, wearing it, those are apparently "disrespectful" too. And there's other odd things, like flying it upside down is a sign of distress. WTF?!!? Seriously, there are more important things to worry about.