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German school gunman 'kills 15'


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Fifteen people have been killed by a teenage gunman who went on a rampage in south-west Germany, officials say.


Among the dead were nine pupils, eight of them girls, and three teachers at the Albertville secondary school in the town of Winnenden, north of Stuttgart.


The gunman, a 17-year-old former pupil, entered the school at about 0930 (0830 GMT) dressed in black combat gear and began shooting - aiming head-high.


He fled in a stolen car, but killed himself after being cornered by police.


German Chancellor Angela Merkel described the shootings as "incomprehensible".


"It is unimaginable that in just seconds, pupils and teachers were killed - it is an appalling crime," she told reporters.


"This is a day of mourning for for the whole of Germany."


Officials earlier said a 10th pupil had died raising the death toll to 16, but this was later revised down to nine pupils.


Baden-Wuerttemberg Interior Minister Heribert Rech said eight of the nine pupils who were killed were girls but he refused to speculate as to whether females in particular were targeted.


Three teachers and three passers-by were the others who died.


Police said the suspect - named locally as Tim Kretschmer - was killed during a shoot-out with officers in the town of Wendlingen, about 40km (25 miles) away from the school.


He had fled there in a car he had hijacked after the school shooting - killing a passer-by as he made his escape, police said.


Spokeswoman Inka Buckmiller said the shoot-out took place at a car showroom, where two bystanders were killed and two police officers were injured.


"The suspect also died as a result of this shooting," she said.


Baden-Wuerttemburg state governor Guenther Oettinger said police killed the suspect, but officers later said he had killed himself.


One woman said her daughter had been in the school at the time of the shooting, and she was now at home "trembling and crying".


"She and her friend jumped out of the window. Her friend is now in hospital... We hope that she's all right," the woman said.


"What can I say? I don't understand the world any more."




Regional police chief Erwin Hetger said the teenager "went into the school with a weapon and carried out a bloodbath", according to the Associated Press.


"I've never seen anything like this in my life," he said.


Mr Hetger said informing the families of what had happened was a heart-breaking job.


"Our thoughts are concentrated on the parents. I have looked some of them in the eye, and it's damn hard to keep your composure," he said.


Local media reported that police had raided the suspect's house and recovered 16 weapons.


The teenager's father, thought to be a prominent businessman in the area, was reported to be a member of a local shooting club.


Eckehard Weiss, who coached Tim Kretschmer at table-tennis, told the BBC that he had been a relatively normal boy.


Mr Weiss said he had wanted to be a professional table-tennis player and had even played a match last weekend.




2006: A former pupil injures 11 students at a school in western town of Emsdetten before turning the gun on himself.

2002: A former pupil kills 17 people in his school in the eastern city of Erfurt, then kills himself.




Left Albertville school last year after passing exams

Officials said he was an ordinary pupil who had received good reports from school

German media reported he had begun an apprenticeship

Lived in the village of Leutenbach

A keen table-tennis player, who aspired to become professional





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Yeah it's really horrible. Nearly all tv channels in my country deal with the rampage. I read about it at noon when I was sitting at university. One of my student fellas used to live in a neighbouring place of Winnenden. So you can imagine he was quite shocked.


Well I think there's not really a solution, a way how to prevent it. Crazy people are everywhere and if they really want to they'll get a gun, no matter if this happens in a legally or illegally way. Anyway, I can already imagine politicians talking about a ban of video games and horror movies... :rolleyes: *yaaaaawn*

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I just noticed that even MTV and VIVA have changed their tv schedules now (like on 9-11). They only play sad songs right now by reason of the current cause. The whole country has a big shock. :\


I already watched Fix you and Yellow there.;)



Still, what a fucking nightmare, why are people doing this? Morbid insanity :wreck:

I'm so sorry for the parents who lost their childs :sad2:

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This is touching me so much. I can't believe it. It's interesting how much these things touch me the older I get...I read it on the internet at work today...I got goosebumps...I talked about it with my work mates, we couldn't believe it...it's so ironic...this morning I heard about the thing that happened in Alabama where 11 people have been killed (11?)....and I thought "oh damn...these things happen so often in America...I'm not surprised, they are allowed to have guns..." and then at work today I read the similar thing happened in Germany...I had to imagine how horrible it must be to be sitting in a lesson and suddenly somebody opens the door and kills your teacher and some of your friends....that's so sick. So super mega sick I don't want to think of it anymore...


My thoughts are with the families and friends of the victims...:sad:

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Interesting point you make, Julia. I associate these things with America too, but we've had quite a few in Canada. It really hits home when it's in your own country. Prayers for the families and friends.


Yes many people on TV who were interviewed said that they do only know these things from the news of America...that's why it shocks us so much...America is so far away...and now it happens here in Germany (again, it also happened some years ago in erfurt which was another horrible happening...)...this kind of violence is still new to us...

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I nominate that we start a new Official Good News thread. The news here is soooo saaadd.


THat's a great idea. A thread where we can post news stories with happy endings so we can cheer ourselves up f rom time to time.:) The world certainly needs more good news.


@Julia: I felt the same way when I heard it. Europe seems so much more civilized. (No offense to the Americans on here.) I hope it doesn't start becoming so common over there.

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I saw a short interview with a criminologist on tv yesterday and he said those school shooters usually plan their attacks in detail over a long period of time prior to the actual shootings. and it seems that nobody really knew that guy, noticed any changes in his behaviour. even though he suddenly stopped playing table-tennis and gaind lots of weight etc. that's scary I think. did noone really talk to that guy?

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Larry is right the whole country is deeply shoked. My school is terribly near that school and we did talk about this all day (yesterday and today). We just can't believe it, we even know pupils from that school, have friends and siblings there. I feel so sorry for the parents, relatives and friends of the victims who are left behind now. :sad2:

The news chanels give you new information every hour and in my opinion the shok still grows. I just hope that there will be no stupid teenagers who think that was 'cool' and do the same or try to do it.

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This case is getting more shocking...he announced it on the internet...he was talking to a guy and said that he will go exactly to that school the next morning and that he will take a gun and start " a barbecue" (that's what he said...) there...and they said on the radio this morning that the head master of the school wanred the the teachers by saying the key word "Miss KOMA (Koma=Amok= the german word for these things....) is coming!" through the loudspeakers...so, this guy wanted it to be much worse also because of the munitions he had...

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New Update:


Online warning by German massacre gunman 'is a forgery'


An online warning which police say was posted by a German school killer was dismissed tonight as a crude internet fake.


German officials said today that Tim Kretschmer, 17, left a message on a chatroom early yesterday morning in which he promised to shoot up his old school in Winnenden because "everyone is laughing at me".


According to the police account, Kretschmer left the message on the Krautchan.net site at 2.45am, almost seven hours before the shooting spree, in which he killed 15 people before turning his gun on himself.


The posting was said to have provided the first clear evidence as to the gunman's motives - he wanted to take revenge because nobody at his former school took him seriously - and provided a clear link with similar school shootings in the past.


The message in question included the lines: "Damn it Bernd, I've had it. I'm sick of this shi**y life, always the same — everyone laughing at me, nobody sees my potential. I'm serious Bernd — I got guns here, and I'm gonna head over to my old school tomorrow and have myself a good ole barbecue."


Heribert Rech, interior minister of the state of Baden-Württemberg, told a press conference that the father of a teenager from Bavaria had contacted police to tell them about the warning.


But Krautchan.net, and its users, immediately denied that any such warning was ever posted on the site and The Times has been told that the message in question was in fact a faked-up image file first posted on Krautchan more than three hours after Kretschmer had committed suicide.


A moderator on the site, identified only as Tsaryu, told The Times: "I even know who posted it, and he's from Dusseldorf. That's not even near Baden-Wuerttemberg."


Krautchan is what is known as an "imageboard" site or "Chan" - which means that its primary purpose is for the posting and discussion of images, many of them ludicrous photoshopped images of a topical nature.


According to a screen-capture of the discussion thread in question, the post containing the image of Kretschmer's message was posted on the site at 4.57pm with the message: "Look at the timestamp on this." Kretschmer had died at 12.30pm.


The "fake" message was timestamped at 2.45am and carried the ID code 485465, both the same as a post 14 hours earlier which started off the online conversation.


Since no two posts can share the same ID, other users immediately cried foul. "Photoshop," the next user wrote.


It is not clear whether the police had seen the entire thread before today's press conference or had simply been sent a copy of the image.


"As one of the moderators of Krautchan I can assure you that the screenshot in question is indeed forgery," Tsaryu said in an e-mail to The Times.


"The faked screencapture (No.486231) was uploaded AFTER the killing spree."


The moderator also pointed out that German media reports had spoken of a conversation between Kretschmer and a friend called Bernd. In fact, under Krautnet protocol, all communications are anonymous - and all users adopt the name Bernd.


"The user in question, who reported it to the police was indeed from Bavaria, but neither was it his friend, nor was he named Bernd. It was one of the many anonymous users on Krautchan."


The homepage of the Krautchan.net site today carried a curt message, in both German and English, announcing that it was down because its servers could not cope with the rush of traffic.


It added: "There's nothing to see anyway, since the German press was unfortunately fooled (and probably not for the first time either) by a forgery.


"No killing spree was announced here, there are only people who know how to use Photoshop."


German police spokesman, Klaus Hinderer, said a search of the gunman's computer revealed no trace of a posting in a chatroom conversation.







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ahhhhh people from Düsseldorf....ahhh


I read many things about it now...reading it feels like watching a horror movie...esp. the key words "Frau Koma kommt" are so scary...


its a scary thought that schools have had to prepare a key phrase to alert teachers without scaring the pupils. for them to have to use it, must be even more dreadful for those teachers

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Yes I was quite surprised that they even had such a "key word" since those thnigs do not happen every day here in Germany...the teachers had to lock the doors as soon as they heard these words....my God I don't want to imagine how the pupils felt, how the teachers felt....it's not a real thing for me...same with this guy in the car shop and his customer who have been shot as well....that's so sick...

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The news chanels give you new information every hour and in my opinion the shok still grows. I just hope that there will be no stupid teenagers who think that was 'cool' and do the same or try to do it.


Yeah I was quite shocked when I was watching n-tv television last afternoon and suddenly they mentioned a bomb alert in Bremen's university. Lots of my friends study there... I was very concerned. Glad we have the weekend now.


Well the rampage is such a tragedy especially the following story...




The 24-year-old teacher died, because she obviously tried to save her pupils. She was married with a policeman who was on the spot as well. :\


Btw, this weekend all Bundesliga teams will play with mourning bands and they will observe a moment of silence in memory of the victims. It's a national tragedy.

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