just because a church says to hate gays does not mean that is what the doctrine teaches. it's just like radical islam, if I understand correctly. It does not teach to be a terrorist, yet many people think it does, because that is how people interpret it (incorrectly)

 

But the fact is that your religious leader preaches hatred of gays. That completely goes against every "love thy fellow man" quote in the bible. That's like ruler Mao telling his people to stage an election. Who has their leader preach against their sacred text?

Maybe some parts of the church are told to hate gays.

 

I've never been told in church to hate gay people. I mean to me I don't see it any differently then any other form of sin. I'm not going to hate a sinner. Look at the people that Jesus hung out with, the poor, the tax collectors, prostitutes, Samaritans, etc. Obviously he didn't just hang out with this eletist group that had it all together.

But the fact is that your religious leader preaches hatred of gays. That completely goes against every "love thy fellow man" quote in the bible. That's like ruler Mao telling his people to stage an election. Who has their leader preach against their sacred text?

 

the person who preaches at the church where I attend does NOT tell people to hate someone because they are gay. That is a stereotype that is created by people who assume they know everything about every christian in the world.

I think the reason some churches preach the hatred of homosexuals (I recall a certain televangelist who like to preach fire-and-brimstone sermons on the subject..) is because of the story of Sodom and Gomorrah. Now, the Old Testament isn't the New Testament, but there's the excuse they use.

I personally feel that homosexuality, while it sometimes creates confusion among us who are strait, is not a sin; simply because for some, it is a matter of hormonal biology, and for others, it's patterning that developed at an early age. This would be like blaming a Holstein cow for having both black and white patches on it's hide:laugh3:..

^ I agree wholeheartedly chuck!

First of all, churches don't preach "hate" against homosexuals. They do preach that it's a sin to practice homosexuality because that what the bible says in the old testiment and in the new. No where in the bible does it EVER say that it's ok to be gay. No where in the bible does it EVER aknowledge a gay couple. It's ALWAYS a man and his wife.

 

Verses in the NT that speak of homosexuality:

 

1Co 6:9 ¶ Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

 

 

Ro 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

Please take the time to read this first post and pray that prayer to God at the bottom of it if you haven't yet.

Three Dog Night: "No, I've never been to heaven... but I kinda like the music..":P "Now If you ever get to Spain (du du du), I've heard the ladies are all insane there.. they won't refuse it; never gonna loose it; they won't abuse it.:laugh3:"du du du..

I like the parable of the 7 virgins and the olive oil the best..:P:o:rolleyes::P

Well, maybe it was lamp oil - oh, I forget! Oh heck, olive oil sounds better. Let's create a new version, since they're all rewrites anyhow - half of the stuff is made up, and the other half is embellished to make it larger than life..:laugh3:

I think the reason some churches preach the hatred of homosexuals (I recall a certain televangelist who like to preach fire-and-brimstone sermons on the subject..) is because of the story of Sodom and Gomorrah. Now, the Old Testament isn't the New Testament, but there's the excuse they use.

I personally feel that homosexuality, while it sometimes creates confusion among us who are strait, is not a sin; simply because for some, it is a matter of hormonal biology, and for others, it's patterning that developed at an early age. This would be like blaming a Holstein cow for having both black and white patches on it's hide:laugh3:..

 

Well if you go by the bible it clearly states it is a sin and God looks badly upon it. I'm not saying believe in the bible, I do and i'd like others to but it's your choice and i have no right forcing it upon you but the bible does make clear its stance on being gay.

 

It can be argued some people who murder or rape do so because of hormones or mental problems that occur in their bodies, yet it is still a sin.

If it's not harming anyone else, it's a personal choice. This is a free country, dammit all, and if you read the works of Thomas Paine, you'll see he was on the right track - even as he faced the guillotine! ...follow your mind, and forget the wizard's smoke and mirrors! Pull back the curtain, and see the light of enlightenment!!

Yes, the bible does condemn those who "would not take a wife, and lived together" somewhere in that story. But it never says "gay".:laugh3: (the world hadn't invented the word yet).. And you know, it's amazing - the whole two cities were completely 'bad', excepting one family (I forget - they were offered "safe passage"). And then God rained burning sulfur down on the cities. How thoughtful. Sheesh, since when is everyone excepting a handful of people "all bad" in any large city! Yikes, this bible looks like a book written by vengeful absolutists, bent on controlling the masses by frightening them into submission! (sounds like a particular President of ours..) "you're either "with us", or you're with the "enemy".. Lord help us if anyone else got killed there who wasn't "wicked" by their definition. Word of god, my ass. It's a damn book, written by power-hungry men in the tribe, and inspired by their particular tribal beliefs and codes of conduct. Some of it makes sense, and other parts look like angry rhetoric, designed to vindicate some horrific act, or allow the ruling few to control the masses.

Free yourselves, and get over it! Let common sense and your clear conscience of cause and effect direct your mind to a better path. It's as simple as "honor truth", following The Golden Rule, and "walking a mile in the shoes of another".. Inside out - cause and effect in society, and the wisdom of the ages.

Let the spirit of enlightenment light the lamp that show the way..

 

Thomas Paine: "All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian, or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit."

"appreciatively acknowledging that Jesus Christ was a "virtuous and an amiable man" and that the "morality that he preached and practised was of the most benevolent kind," Paine portrayed Jesus "the person," as a preacher of the "equality of man" and a "reformer and revolutionist."

So, better to see the examples set, and understand underlying principles that benefit society, as well as the individual sacrifice.

Paine titled his work The Age of Reason, and dedicated it to the American people. Paine was in the best sense, a citizen of the world, and a member of the enlightenment.

Gosh darn it, how the f*** can you call loving someone a sin? How is a man loving a man, etc hurting anyone? If the bible said urination is a sin, would you think it is a sin? Do you question it at all? God gave us brains. Do you really feel in your deepest soul and gut that gay people are sinners, or do you just say so because of the bible? What if you were gay: would you really choose to spend the rest of your life without true love and affection b/c of the bible? One thing you can never deny or control is how you feel. You only control your actions. And love is not a sin. Sex is not a sin between consenting adults when there is love. [/rant]

Gosh darn it, how the f*** can you call loving someone a sin? How is a man loving a man, etc hurting anyone? If the bible said urination is a sin, would you think it is a sin? Do you question it at all? God gave us brains. Do you really feel in your deepest soul and gut that gay people are sinners, or do you just say so because of the bible? What if you were gay: would you really choose to spend the rest of your life without true love and affection b/c of the bible? One thing you can never deny or control is how you feel. You only control your actions. And love is not a sin. Sex is not a sin between consenting adults when there is love. [/rant]

 

...what if someone wanted to have sex with a dog and marry a dog and live with a dog, would that be ok? ...but what if that's the way they "feel"?

Gosh darn it, how the f*** can you call loving someone a sin? How is a man loving a man, etc hurting anyone? If the bible said urination is a sin, would you think it is a sin? Do you question it at all? God gave us brains. Do you really feel in your deepest soul and gut that gay people are sinners, or do you just say so because of the bible? What if you were gay: would you really choose to spend the rest of your life without true love and affection b/c of the bible? One thing you can never deny or control is how you feel. You only control your actions. And love is not a sin. Sex is not a sin between consenting adults when there is love. [/rant]

 

Life does not work how we want it to...the world is fucked up. My problem with people is 2 things, 1) they try to force religion on people(like this dude) and 2) people make up their own reality based on how they want things to be.

 

Some people are born sinful ways, it sucks and it's life, no one said it made sense or was fair, but you can't make up what is a sin and isn't. I'm not saying you have to believe the bible, but if you're basing things off of the bible and God then gay sex is a sin.

Life does not work how we want it to...the world is fucked up. My problem with people is 2 things, 1) they try to force religion on people(like this dude) and 2) people make up their own reality based on how they want things to be.

 

Some people are born sinful ways, it sucks and it's life, no one said it made sense or was fair, but you can't make up what is a sin and isn't. I'm not saying you have to believe the bible, but if you're basing things off of the bible and God then gay sex is a sin.

 

Why is it that when a Christian states his opinion, somehow it's forcing our views on people, but when you state your opinion that it's somehow not forcing yours? Christians go by the bible. You can believe the bible or not, but don't say that I am forcing my views on you simply because you don't agree. That's so hippacritical when you are also stating your opinion.

:lock::lock::lock:

In the words of Conor Oberst "Set fire to the preacher who is promising us hell"

To FrodoBaggins, Questions:

 

1. Do you have to be Christian to go to Heaven? Is being a good, kind person good enough?

 

2. Hell - Is it fire and brimstone for eternity? Or - Is it an eternity without God? Could Hell simply be God's last mercy for those that don't believe in him, a place where God is not there?

 

Thanks,

Goodness, is this thing still going?

 

Hate to be mean about it, but it's not the message, it's the attitude...

Nice message Frodo. Don't let people get in your way of spreading the word.

I think this thread should be locked...not because of the topic but because of the response to it....

:lock::lock::lock::lock::lock::lock::lock::lock::lock::lock::lock::lock::lock::lock:

...what if someone wanted to have sex with a dog and marry a dog and live with a dog, would that be ok? ...but what if that's the way they "feel"?

 

 

That's different. But some people will do it anyways. I was strictly talking about humans.