I blame the FA

I blame Beckham, if he'd taken the bloody offer of an international testimonial to mark his career and then fucked off for good, Milner might not even have played. And then I'd blame the FA.

Fergie will never "retire" he will have a heart-attack during a stressful game and pass away :(

 

Oooh I wouldn't have wanted to say that. Either way he's the sort of guy who will think 'I won't retire football. Football will retire me'. Wouldn't be surprised.

 

Anyhow what a rancid performance by England. What a complete sham of an international football team. Massive changes across the board is needed. Not going to happen is it though. If you look up denial in the dictionary it will point towards the England national football team.

Oooh I wouldn't have wanted to say that. Either way he's the sort of guy who will think 'I won't retire football. Football will retire me'. Wouldn't be surprised.

 

Anyhow what a rancid performance by England. What a complete sham of an international football team. Massive changes across the board is needed. Not going to happen is it though. If you look up denial in the dictionary it will point towards the England national football team.

 

Let's face it - it's a total shambles.:dozey:

I blame Man City

I blame that inbred big eared **** Richard Scudamore.

It's hard for me to say this but Rafa's been heading for this ever since he thought he could appoint yes men rather than men who would challenge Rafa's decisions. Pako Ayesteran ex Assistant manager with rafa at Valencia and Liverpool? Alex Miller ex first team coach at Liverpool? They weren't yes men but once they were shoved out Liverpool started going downhill. Rafa was lucky that he got 2nd place in the league a couple of years back but the real mess became evident last year.

 

Rafa needs to fuck off and start coaching kids games, hes lost it.

Not really a fan of Ronaldo but this would have been a great goal. Can't blame him for being pissed off at being robbed of it.

 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSibXcefKMc]YouTube - HD Cristaino Ronaldo Disallowed Goal - Portugal vs Spain 4-0 - Friendly - 17/10/2010[/ame]

 

Seen the list for the Fifa goal of the year award.

http://www.fifa.com/ballondor/puskasaward/index.html

 

Of those shortlisted i would say its between van Bronckhorst, Burrows and Hallineus. I would personally give it to Hallineus the skill and the finish of the whole move was sweet.

 

Would be awesome if Burrows won it though.

^Well even without that Spain got a real spanking!:stunned:

Anyhow what a rancid performance by England. What a complete sham of an international football team. Massive changes across the board is needed. Not going to happen is it though. If you look up denial in the dictionary it will point towards the England national football team.

 

Hahaha! Holy shit, it was a friendly.

It's irrelevant whether it was a friendly or not. It was a friendly for France too, yet they showed our lot up big time.

The fact is, whenever England come up against a major footballing force (which in spite of their poor showing at the World Cup, France undeniably are) nowadays, they are found to be lacking.

True, France had an appalling World Cup, but they can at least heap a lot of the blame on a bad coach and the disruptive attitude of certain players.

England, on the other hand, seem to keep going backwards irrespective of who the manager is or who plays.

I would love for that not to be the case, but the difference in class last night was there for all to see.:dozey:

It's irrelevant

 

Yes friendlies are irrelevant.

 

I'm not saying the game was 100% meaningless, we got a glimpse as to how the future England may look, but not really because they were all so uncomfortable out there. Why? Because their fans are idiots who heap on way too much pressure for games that don't even matter. A young French team went out and played their game, and they did it well, because they weren't afraid of getting booed by their own fans.

 

Nobody realy wants to play for England anymore because of how shit the media and especially the fans treat them, booing your own team is crazy. The fact is that you look at that England team and it's just not that good, and England fans need to realise that they simply don't have the talent of teams like France or Spain, but having that expectation that decent players should suddenly become world beaters is making England worse then they should be.

Yes friendlies are irrelevant.

 

I'm not saying the game was 100% meaningless, we got a glimpse as to how the future England may look

 

Sh*t?:rolleyes:

 

but not really because they were all so uncomfortable out there. Why? Because their fans are idiots who heap on way too much pressure for games that don't even matter. A young French team went out and played their game, and they did it well, because they weren't afraid of getting booed by their own fans.

 

That still doesn't excuse the obvious gulf in skill-level and ball-control between the two teams, though.

 

Nobody realy wants to play for England anymore because of how shit the media and especially the fans treat them, booing your own team is crazy.

 

That I agree with. Not applauding them off at the end of the match if they have underperformed would be more than sufficient to make fans' feelings known.

 

The fact is that you look at that England team and it's just not that good, and England fans need to realise that they simply don't have the talent of teams like France or Spain, but having that expectation that decent players should suddenly become world beaters is making England worse then they should be.

 

The question is, why don't they have the talent of teams like France, Spain or Portugal?

It isn't as if any of those countries have vastly greater populations, superior leagues or anything like that.:dozey:

Well why they don't have the talent is a much broader topic, and again, last night's friendly was quite meaningless, back to the point- I don't see why last night's performance should be the triggering factor to how England need a complete revamp.

 

The main reason England don't have the talent is because clubs would rather spend £20million on a new foreign signing instead of putting £20million into the youth academy. The Premier league is so reliant on foreign players that the focus on local talent is completely lost.

 

Also, the culture of football, playing it, watching it, is so closely associated with the culture of drinking. You won't find kids who play basketball or do martial arts drinking after training, but it's pretty common for kids who play football to do so. This isn't the culture in France, look at the strength and power of that team, they're just pure athletes, English players are certainly a lot more relaxed even when it comes to not even getting drunk but having a few pints, and in the highly competitive top class of football this can set them back.

 

Their main problem is the fans and media though, Italy also have this problem (Though the medias probably even harsher).

Well why they don't have the talent is a much broader topic, and again, last night's friendly was quite meaningless, back to the point- I don't see why last night's performance should be the triggering factor to how England need a complete revamp.

 

On the back of that one result, of course not. However, when was the last time England played impressively against one of the top international sides, either in a friendly or in a competitive match?

Answers on a postcard?:rolleyes:

 

The main reason England don't have the talent is because clubs would rather spend £20million on a new foreign signing instead of putting £20million into the youth academy. The Premier league is so reliant on foreign players that the focus on local talent is completely lost.

 

Also, the culture of football, playing it, watching it, is so closely associated with the culture of drinking. You won't find kids who play basketball or do martial arts drinking after training, but it's pretty common for kids who play football to do so. This isn't the culture in France, look at the strength and power of that team, they're just pure athletes, English players are certainly a lot more relaxed even when it comes to not even getting drunk but having a few pints, and in the highly competitive top class of football this can set them back.

 

Definitely all contributory factors. You only have to look at the likes of Rooney, Terry, Ashley Cole and now Carroll to see what kind of player is being produced in England (I'm not talking about their levels of talent or ability, but their general attitude and unprofessional behaviour off the pitch).

 

Their main problem is the fans and media though, Italy also have this problem (Though the medias probably even harsher).

 

Maybe so, but how many bad World Cups or European Championships have they had throughout history? Or Germany or France for that matter?

Nowhere near as many as England, I'll bet. Plus it was only four years ago that Italy won the World Cup, while England flopped dismally yet again.

 

Admittedly Spain underachieved for many years, but they've more than made up for it now.

 

 

Yes, even if you remove friendlies and qualifying matches from the equation, the evidence is there for all to see. That defeat to Germany in the summer was particularly embarrassing. It wasn't even as if Germany were that good, either.

I hate to admit it, but England are pathetic, and there are no signs of that changing in the foreseeable future.:(

Well why they don't have the talent is a much broader topic, and again, last night's friendly was quite meaningless, back to the point- I don't see why last night's performance should be the triggering factor to how England need a complete revamp.

 

The main reason England don't have the talent is because clubs would rather spend £20million on a new foreign signing instead of putting £20million into the youth academy. The Premier league is so reliant on foreign players that the focus on local talent is completely lost.

 

Also, the culture of football, playing it, watching it, is so closely associated with the culture of drinking. You won't find kids who play basketball or do martial arts drinking after training, but it's pretty common for kids who play football to do so. This isn't the culture in France, look at the strength and power of that team, they're just pure athletes, English players are certainly a lot more relaxed even when it comes to not even getting drunk but having a few pints, and in the highly competitive top class of football this can set them back.

 

Their main problem is the fans and media though, Italy also have this problem (Though the medias probably even harsher).

 

Surely the World Cup triggered the need for a complete revamp? But I agree with you on the rest. The press and the fans all cried their eyes out calling for blood but within days Sky, BBC etc were all speculating about Man City's next big signing along with English supporters of their clubs concerning themselves with who they would sign. It's shocking and displays the incredibly hypocritical nature of the English press and fans.

Surely the World Cup triggered the need for a complete revamp? But I agree with you on the rest. The press and the fans all cried their eyes out calling for blood but within days Sky, BBC etc were all speculating about Man City's next big signing along with supporters concerning themselves with who they would sign. It's shocking and displays the incredibly hypocritical nature of the English press and fans.

 

Yes, and how daft were those fans who splashed out all that cash to go out to South Africa expecting England to actually achieve something?

Their reaction to the abject performances was ridiculous. What planet are they from?:dozey:

Surely the World Cup triggered the need for a complete revamp?

 

Sorry I got the impression that your initial post insinuated that last night was the stand-out moment that England need to change.

 

As for the fans who paid to go the World Cup, you'd think they'd at least be gracious towards the team, they played shit and probably got further then they deserve, but they got to the freaking World Cup, support them to the end and have a bit of humility, you won it 40 years ago you don't have any right to claim ownership of it.

 

And did anyone see Argentina returning home? They had a massive celebration party for them, HUNDREDS of THOUSANDS of people lined the streets to welcome them home, and it wasn't even an official ceremony or anything, they all turned up just to cheer the players who were inside their team bus. Now take into consideration that Argentina probably had a much better chance of winning it, and they went out in the same round as England, and look at the different reactions by the people.

 

Not to sound vaguely racist, but English people have a bit of a fucked up mentality towards sports, a bit like Australians, it's like either you win or you're a totally rubbish nonsense loser etc. It's almost like they enjoy losing and being miserable more then winning, even if England had got to the final and lost they'd still be seen as failures.

As for the fans who paid to go the World Cup, you'd think they'd at least be gracious towards the team, they played shit and probably got further then they deserve, but they got to the freaking World Cup, support them to the end and have a bit of humility, you won it 40 years ago you don't have any right to claim ownership of it.

 

I agree. What I really couldn't believe was how they were all whinging and complaining that the team had let them down (as if it was personal), some of them even having the temerity to suggest they should be refunded! I mean, how deluded can you get?:dozey:

 

And did anyone see Argentina returning home? They had a massive celebration party for them, HUNDREDS of THOUSANDS of people lined the streets to welcome them home, and it wasn't even an official ceremony or anything, they all turned up just to cheer the players who were inside their team bus. Now take into consideration that Argentina probably had a much better chance of winning it, and they went out in the same round as England, and look at the different reactions by the people.

 

In fact, Argentina reached the quarter-finals, a round further than England, subsequently losing to Germany.

Admittedly they also underachieved, however, and I reckon the welcome home they got was therefore almost as ludicrous as the England fans' reaction. Both were ridiculously excessive.:dozey:

 

Not to sound vaguely racist, but English people have a bit of a fucked up mentality towards sports, a bit like Australians, it's like either you win or you're a totally rubbish nonsense loser etc. It's almost like they enjoy losing and being miserable more then winning, even if England had got to the final and lost they'd still be seen as failures.

 

A proportion of English people, certainly, and probably the most vocal ones, unfortunately.

However, in the extremely unlikely event that England had reached the final, or even the semis, any right-minded individual would have regarded it as a successful campaign.

Even if England had played out of their skins (which they didn't) and lost to Germany in a hard-fought match, I would have accepted it.

It was the manner of the defeat that was a disgrace, not the defeat itself.;)

Ah I wasn't sure if Argentina went out in the quarters, but like you say, still underachieved and the reception they got when returning was as if they'd won the thing, it was crazy.

 

Yes I was exaggerating about real fans being unhappy even if they got to the Final, but people who don't follow football are incredibly negative about it over there. Think of your Jeremy Clarkson types, they'd still just dismiss it as an English failure even if they got to the final.

 

I know what you mean that the players really showed no belief, but that's because the fans don't believe in them, it's a vicious cycle.

Ah I wasn't sure if Argentina went out in the quarters, but like you say, still underachieved and the reception they got when returning was as if they'd won the thing, it was crazy.

 

Probably has something to do with the fact that footballers are treated like gods in South America, and not just "celebrities", as they are in England.

 

Yes I was exaggerating about real fans being unhappy even if they got to the Final, but people who don't follow football are incredibly negative about it over there. Think of your Jeremy Clarkson types, they'd still just dismiss it as an English failure even if they got to the final.

 

Although to be fair to Jeremy Clarkson himself, he's being sarcastic and saying stuff for comedic effect most of the time. The problem is, there probably are lots of viewers who think he's actually being serious.:dozey:

 

I know what you mean that the players really showed no belief, but that's because the fans don't believe in them, it's a vicious cycle.

 

Players at that level shouldn't be depending on the fans to motivate them to play well. They should just go out there and do the business (and I mean on the pitch, not off it).

Whether or not they should be able to be professional and go out and play regardless of what's happening around them, they aren't. That's the reality of it, whether right or wrong, there's clearly a real lack of motivation for playing in that shirt right now. I don't think the regular England players even enjoy playing for their country anymore, and I suspect that they don't enjoy playing for Capello. You can see just from their body language on that pitch, they constantly look frustrated with eachother and it gets worse as the game progresses, and their football can be awfully dull.

 

For an instant revamp the solution is pretty clear- get rid of Capello. I respect him as much as you can respect any manager, but only at club level, that's where his discipline and hardline tactics actually work because he's there to enforce it week in week out. With international management you are a bit like a substitute teacher who takes charge of the kids every now and then, obviously your rules won't be respected if they know they'll only have to deal with you for a short amount of time.

 

And for these England players he's brought in orders of absolutely no alcohol (He broke that rule once by buying the players ONE beer after they won that world cup game, which he probably had good intentions by doing so but if you drink alcohol you'll know that's almost like mocking you haha) and enforced orders of being in bed by 10pm. So these England players who have all the freedom to do whatever they want while they play for their club, coming back to Capello's rules for a week is like a chore.

 

They'll easily qualify, because their group is a fucking joke (Yes I am speaking as a bitter Ireland supporter in the knowledge that England have been incredibly lucky in the draw for a big competition twice in a row) and if Capello's still with them then it'll all be pretty pointless because they'll just get squashed by real competitors on the main stage.

^The way it's looking at the moment, I'm afraid you're probably right. Qualification followed by failure in the finals, as has become the custom.

I had actually thought Capello was a good choice when he was appointed, as he's a disciplinarian, but it clearly hasn't worked.

I think he's far too old-fashioned, and his English is nowhere near good enough. Compared to him, Sven speaks English like a "native".

I'm not saying McClaren was any better, but I believe the "foreign manager" experiment has failed, and the next manager should be English.

At least the communication would then be better.

 

Eire, of course, have a good excuse not to qualify, and not only because of the quality of their group.

The country's population is much smaller, and there are far fewer players of the required standard to choose from.

What Jack Charlton managed to achieve with them was incredible. Nobody could accuse them of underachieving.

 

Torquay fans turn volume down on piped music

 

18th November 2010

 

Fans at Torquay United have persuaded the club to stop playing “celebratory” music after every goal “in an attempt to encourage even more of an atmosphere at Plainmoor”. Supporters were taken by surprise on Saturday when Elliot Benyon’s 11th minute opener was followed by the indie-pop strains of The Fratellis’ Chelsea Dagger.

If fans were to draw up a list of pet hates there’s little doubt that post-goal music, piped through a club’s loudspeakers, would be high on the list. Despite this a surprising number of clubs seem to think this is actually a great idea. After all, American sports do it – so what’s not to love? However, the overwhelming majority of fans think it’s a terrible idea.

 

“I hate the idea at grounds but couldn’t quite distinguish what it was,” said Hayden Jones of Torquay United Supporters’ Trust. “We all just looked at each other in bemusement and asked what’s that?” He wasn’t the only one judging by the response on Torquay message boards TorquayFans.com and TorquayFansForum.Proboards.com.

 

“A goal for your side is the culmination of the many emotions of watching football. If I'm at Plainmoor and music follows a goal it will ruin the experience for me. If the best part of a ‘matchday experience’ is ruined by this Americanised crap, then I don't want to be part of it,” argued UpminsterGull from TorquayFans.com. Well said that man.

 

So whose idea was it? “We regularly have a fans forum where the manager and chairman come together and it was mooted from the floor that we could play celebratory music,” explains the Gulls’ spokesman Darryl Haggan. “It was part of a wider strategy to get more people in alongside cheaper tickets [credit to Torquay, U19s can get in for as little as £6] and so on. I stood on the terraces myself when I was younger and knew it would go down with fans like a lead balloon.”

 

Much to Darryl’s surprise though the response from those at the open meeting wasn’t overwhelmingly negative and this seems to have encouraged the club’s hierarchy to pursue the idea. The fact that the idea stemmed from a supporters’ liaison meeting is pretty ironic and a salutary lesson in why fans should engage with their clubs when the opportunity arises. If you don’t, it could be your club next…

 

As Torquay don’t have an official anthem the choice of music was always going to be contentious – but how did they end up with The Fratellis’ Chelsea Dagger? Blame it on a simple twist of fate, as someone once said. Darryl Haggan picks up the story.

 

“I was told by someone a little higher up the chain than me to play the song from Sky Sports, I knew the one he meant but couldn’t remember who it was by or its name. I passed the message on to our PA guy but unfortunately he got it wrong and played Chelsea Dagger after we scored. I still don’t know what the song is actually called we meant to play!

 

“After the goal I wrote on a piece of paper and held it up against the glass for the PA guy to see saying “IT’S THE WRONG SONG!”. He was already almost hiding under his desk as he knew the fans wouldn’t like it but after that he hid a little more - I told him to shut the windows too!”

 

Credit to Darryl and Torquay United though, they received scores of emails from fans venting their anger, took the criticism on the chin and actually listened to supporters. Within days they’d posted a message on TorquayUnited.com acknowledging their mistake and have now suspended the playing of music.

 

Memo to clubs: let the atmosphere at a match speak for itself, turn the volume down on the pre-game MC and – whatever you do – never play post-goal piped music.

^Haha fucking right on, nothing more annoying then music right after a goal. It's incredibly cheesy.

 

Eire, of course, have a good excuse not to qualify, and not only because of the quality of their group.

The country's population is much smaller, and there are far fewer players of the required standard to choose from.

What Jack Charlton managed to achieve with them was incredible. Nobody could accuse them of underachieving.

 

Thank you, it may sound silly because of the difference of achievements (qualifying for tournaments) I'd rather support Ireland instead of England because Irish fans will be proud of their nation nomatter what happens, right now our squad looks very shaky but the last thing we'd do is boo them.