Hello everyone.

 

You may remember me from such places around the forum as "The Lounge" and "What is this fool doing in the Coldplay section?", as well as "Backhanding the Blind Fan 8: Electric Boogaloo - Part 2"

 

In this thread I post my occasional Coldplay musings, as putting them on Facebook all the time will probably piss people off and The Lounge doesn't need any of dat stuff in their biz

Hopefully they will bring up some good discussion, please say why you agree or disagree... you know, reasonings.

If you're just going to say WOW THIS IS GREAT, use the thanks button for heaven's sake, that's why it's there.

 

Topics History:

TOPIC NUMERO UNO, CONTROVERSIALO: Princess of China is not that bad (really)

TOPIC NUMERO UNO, CONTROVERSIALO: Princess of China is not that bad (really)

 

Apologies for the terrible title. Straight off the bat with what is likely to be a highly contested topic!

 

Please note, a disclaimer: I have pretty much 0 musical training. This is just based off my listening opinion, and probably mostly my feels.

 

The songs of discussion, for the uninitiated:

 

 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Uw6ZkbsAH8]Coldplay - Princess Of China ft. Rihanna - YouTube[/ame]

 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vblNj75hUpM]Coldplay - AMSTERDAM - YouTube[/ame]

 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fyMhvkC3A84]Coldplay - Every Teardrop Is a Waterfall - YouTube[/ame]

 

 

I recently discovered, when up late and rather unusually listening to Coldplay songs instead of sleeping, that I actually knew the words to Princess of China.

 

 

Being a very slightly old-timey, more 'classic' Coldplay fan that pretty much thinks A Rush Of Blood To the Head was their best album effort, Viva La Vida[...] was a highly worthy artistic venture and Mylo Xyloto was very questionable at times but had some redeeming features, this was a bit of a rude shock.

 

'But Princess of China is lyrically rubbish,' I thought. 'They wrote it just so Rihanna could be on the album. How does it even fit with the rest thematically apart from pounding beats and waves of synth? And don't get me started on 'YOU STOLE MY STAR ALALLAALALALLAALAA!!!'... what lazy lyrics.'

 

Yes, to me, this is not a particularly a deep or meaningful song. Though I think... just quietly, to myself... I enjoy it slightly.

 

It's one of those guilty pleasures for me. I don't enjoy it because the lyrics are not brutally honest in their emotiveness (that's not a real word, but I'm going with it) like many past Coldplay songs - and really, it isn't trying to be. Nor is it trying to be particularly original, complex or clever. It's catchy and a bit fun, sneaking into your memory. This, to me, is what Coldplay at least somewhat set out to do when they made Princess of China... and it does it fairly well.

 

I feel like it gets a lot of hate for that. Sure, it's not the best at being a monumental break-up song, as it does fail to convey the actual emotion behind 'hurt' in my opinion. You might want to listen to Amsterdam for a better idea of Coldplay accomplishing that.

 

Let's, on the other hand, look at a song like Every Teardrop Is a Waterfall.

 

This is pretty much one of those stadium anthems that are meant to inspire people to get moving along to the music inside a biggity big big venue. It certainly does try... again with thumping beats, as well as lyrics about singing and dancing and how wonderful all that is; that really aren't very emotive or complicated.

 

But to me, this is where Every Teardrop Is a Waterfall falls short. It's not catchy enough to be memorable or infectiously fun. It doesn't pull at any sort of heartstrings that would make me sing or dance (while I generally don't dance, I just go by what I feel would make a reasonable person want to do so). It fails at what I think Coldplay set out to do and make me feel. For this reason, I think it is actually worse than Princess of China in it's pure mediocrity.

 

 

Time for reader dear's opinions: do you think Princess of China is really as bad as the initial hate indicated? Has your initial opinion of it changed? What do you like or dislike about it? Is it fair to judge a song based on qualities it may not be trying to accomplish, or fair game? etc

WOW THIS IS GREAT!

 

hihihi

 

A lot (not all of it) of the hate is focused on Rihanna being there, I think. People saying they just wanted to reach "new audiences", "target young people". I strongly disagree with that saying and to me it's a bit unfair to trash the song because of it. But of course if you absolutely hate a singer and they happen to sing in one particular song, I understand why you may hate that song too :lol: There's also just general dislike over the sound of it, the lack of emotion etc. Personally I like the song, I don't find it horrible. I do not listen to it a lot though and hearing it 10 times in a row during the soundcheck and then twice during the actual concert was way too much. :sick:

I remember that during that work placement I did last Spring, my colleague would always turn on some sort of rap/rnb radio, and PoC was played all the time and it made me quite happy every time, even though it was mostly because I was hearing Coldplay and not because I adored the song itself.

 

I definitely agree that they've had waaaaay better attempts (and actual successes) at transmitting "true" emotion. :nod: I don't think that's what they were going for anyway. What they did manage to do though is to not completely lose themselves despite Rihanna's featuring. I keep saying that my sister told me once, "ugh Princess of China sounds like any other Coldplay song" Of course, she has never heard Amsterdam or, idk, Rainy Day or whatever, but to me it still shows that you can clearly identify it as a Coldplay song. It is still Coldplay, and I think the result is quite balanced between making it "Rihanna-friendly" and still a bit of a Coldplay song. And, if you consider the issue from the point of a view of a fan of Rihanna, the change of style must have been much more shocking than for us!

I personally disagree on your remarks on ETIAW, as I absolutely love this song and it does make me dance ("well, some kind of fit") :lol: I also found that it was the perfect closer to the live set. It was really a highlight of the concert, to me :nod:

 

the overall point with the etiaw comparison is that poc is hated unfairly for things it's not trying to do (bar the conveyance of hurt emotion), meanwhile songs that are pretty bland for what they're meant to accomplish get off relatively unscathed, maybe just a snippy mention but largely forgotten and nowhere near as trashed

 

i actually have an etiaw live recording on my ipod off one of the singles, i can't remember which, and it does sound better than the album one, i agree. however my mind goes back to the studio version every time because that's what i and what other people are more likely to hear the most.

Well I like all the songs on MX, but I must agree that ETIAW seems like it is...missing something. I've thought this from the first time I heard it and Princess of china, but that doesn't mean I don't enjoy hearing them. Great thread btw.

i've always thought princess of china was pretty good for a pop song and rihanna is the best part of that song i just don't feel chris does pop singer so well. i think paradise has grown a little but then i get to a certain point in the song and i'm like nope.

also i think fans just seem to hate it when another artist gets involved who is more mainstream like i'm pretty sure people were annoyed when jay-z was involved though i genuinely just hated lost alltogether.

also i think fans just seem to hate it when another artist gets involved who is more mainstream like i'm pretty sure people were annoyed when jay-z was involved though i genuinely just hated lost alltogether.

 

another decent point i guess but i didn't feel the jay-z collab particularly added anything at least

When I heard Coldplay was going to make a song with Rihanna, I thought that was the moment they'd go rubbish and when I heard the song for the first time all I was thinking was: ew ewwew I don't like it. This is the first Coldplay song I don't like ew. Then I didn't listen again. When the radio played it a few times it kind of grew on me and now I don't hate it but I still think it's one of their weakest songs. I don't like the way Chris sings and for me it's just a pop song, a good one, but still just a pop song.

I like Every Teardrop Is A Waterfall more because it's a happy song and I actually like the lyrics. I also think it did succeed at making people dance and sing along. I unfortunately missed the MX tour but when I watch Live 2012 I see one happy crowd during the song (not only during that song, actually). I think it would be one of my highlights too.

 

Interesting thread, btw!

Oh goodness, thank you Cobalt. This makes me feel a little better, and not quite as ashamed as I felt last week when PoC came up on random play on my iPod.

 

To hit on your point regarding ETIAW, I think my initial wtfery toward PoC was propelled by the fact I was already a bit miffed about wasting $1 of my hard-earned money on ETIAW (actually more than $1, because I also sprung for the CD and vinyl so that means that I bought ETIAW three times, aarrrrggghh).

 

So although my dislike of ETIAW still stands, I'm at the point now where I cock my head to the side a bit when I hear PoC and think "hmmm... that's not so bad."

 

Now this makes me wonder what my initial reaction to PoC would have been if they hadn't released ETIAW first.

Oh goodness, thank you Cobalt. This makes me feel a little better, and not quite as ashamed as I felt last week when PoC came up on random play on my iPod.

 

To hit on your point regarding ETIAW, I think my initial wtfery toward PoC was propelled by the fact I was already a bit miffed about wasting $1 of my hard-earned money on ETIAW (actually more than $1, because I also sprung for the ED and vinyl so that means that I bought ETIAW three times, aarrrrggghh).

 

So although my dislike of ETIAW still stands, I'm at the point now where I cock my head to the side a bit when I hear PoC and think "hmmm... that's not so bad."

 

Now this makes me wonder what my initial reaction to PoC would have been if they hadn't released ETIAW first.

 

My new fav word! "wtfery" thanks Carrrie!

Personally, I kind of like PoC and a couple of the other more pop oriented tracks on MX. The band (and especially Chris) seem to always have had an affinity for various pop styles, so it just seems fitting that they've finally come to being at peace with including that type of material on their own records. They still can do the old style stuff, but pop oriented stuff is a legitimate part of their personal identity as musicians.

I agree that the idea of Princess of China (a glossy duet between a pop band and a pop star) is worse than the song itself. I think many people decided they wouldn't like it before they'd even heard it. Me included.

The song is not so bad. It's kind of catchy and their voices go well together. I enjoy the acoustic version. It's ambient, curious and light instead of heavily synthezised, which makes me wonder what would have happened if they picked that to go on the album instead.

I did think it was a low point in the setlist, the band playing along with a taped Rihanna. Never again.

 

ETIAW never did anything for me and I disliked it as a closer. It felt like a forced Viva la Vida, a call for people standing up and fighting together, but without any sort of frustration that's crucial to get them to do that. I just never felt it.

I liked it. I think Coldplay just made the music they wanted to make. I think the acoustic version is brilliant. Also, when I listen to it, I recognise the genius of Chris' songwriting still in there somewhere.

When I first listened to PoC, I was like "hey, this is different. hmmm..." I must admit that I had to get used to the song. i hardly listen to it now but occasionally i feel like "ok, let me listen to PoC".

 

 

i sometimes make a parody and sing that instead :P hehehehehe

 

 

As for ETIAW, i really like it. :)

one of the things i like most about POC is that it is a duet, and you get to hear both sides... and they're both blaming each other. :P it's not the best song ever, no, and certainly not the best from MX, but it is a good song.

 

 

ETIAW, on the other hand, gets me pumped every time. but i was always a fan of I Go to Rio as a kid, so maybe that influenced it. :P

I really like POC, i like the beat and both voices, the thing the i absolutely hate are the lyrics but thank god i'm italian and i have the "power" to shut down my brain and not understand the words that they are saying so i can ignore them.

I prefer the acoustic version and even more the Invisible Men Remix which gave a better beat than the original one and makes the song really cool.

 

On the other hand ETIAW it's one of the few coldplay songs that hurts my ears, the beginning is one of the most annoying things that coldplay has never created, the lyrics are even worse than poc, the only things i like are the music video and the end in the live performances.

 

Guys check out the Invisible Men Remix of POC, that's something that makes you move

i will always hate the music video for princess of china tho and it belongs in the bin

I agree that the idea of Princess of China (a glossy duet between a pop band and a pop star) is worse than the song itself. I think many people decided they wouldn't like it before they'd even heard it. Me included.

The song is not so bad. It's kind of catchy and their voices go well together. I enjoy the acoustic version. It's ambient, curious and light instead of heavily synthezised, which makes me wonder what would have happened if they picked that to go on the album instead.

I did think it was a low point in the setlist, the band playing along with a taped Rihanna. Never again.

 

ETIAW never did anything for me and I disliked it as a closer. It felt like a forced Viva la Vida, a call for people standing up and fighting together, but without any sort of frustration that's crucial to get them to do that. I just never felt it.

 

EITIAW works for me in context. They released it just before their summer festival tour and it's a great summer single, upbeat and dancy. Also, it was a good taster for the broader direction the album was going to take, which is important in a lead off single IMHO. Not my favorite song of theirs by a long, long, long way, but it was the right song at the right moment I think.

Like they said before, nice job Cobalt! I like this thread.

 

Princess of China:

I really like the song in general. I'm not quite fond of the idea of Coldplay and Rihanna doing a collab but I'm satisfied with the result. :D

The Lyrics: I really like the bit of storytelling even though it's quite simplistic.

The Music:I like the both the acoustic and the original, haven't heard of the remix yet. It's sort of a pop-ethic-ish theme with a bit of Coldplay.

The Singing: My opinions are switched between Chris being the weaker part of the song or the two have a really good musical chemistry.

The Video: Until now, my brains still hurts and I don't want to talk about it.:sick:

ETIAW:

I think it's good, though I think it works best as a concert song in general.