"Coldplay didn't purposely steal Joe's song...

Joe's just being possessive and maybe alittle bit paranoid.

As others have said here, it will probably be settled out of court.

This isn't going to break Coldplay"

 

What gets me is the fact that this whole thing is just fodder for the meatheads that hate Coldplay to bitch and moan even more. Just look at the purely hateful tone of some of the posts on that AOL post. Even if a band did plagiarize, nothing really justifies the kind of venom directed at them personally in some posts. It's just really negative vibes..:(

 

"I think you'd be hard pressed finding a guitarist from any genre who *hasn't* heard Joe Satriani."

 

I think your statement applies to the US more than the rest of the world. He isn't that well known in the UK... until now!

This needs to get settled quickly. If you can not detect a similarity, at least in that one section (you all know what I am talking about by now), you are deaf. First, Chris Martin specifically (he writes the lyrics and this is a vocal melody that is in question) needs to be honest about whether it is a coincidence or a conscious effort that a section of Viva la Vida sounds like the Satriani song. If it is not a coincidence, Coldplay should have asked the man if they could sample his music and paid him accordingly. Now that it is after the fact, they may be court ordered to pay Satriani adequate compensation. With that said, I think we are walking a fine line between "inspiration" and "plagiarism." I do not want these issues ending up in court because it will be never ending. I can turn on the radio and find a million examples of artists who have copied (or stole from) other artists. Are we going to sue every one of them? I read a quote by Tom Petty where he said he could sue several artists (I think he referenced The Strokes) for plagiarism, however, would not do it unless he felt that the artist was directly stealing. Clearly, Viva la Vida is a completely different song than the Satriani tune. I wish Satriani would just leave it at that. Also, I think taking legal action days after the Grammy nominations is as low as you can go. For the future, Coldplay needs to operate on the honor system (if, in fact, it is intentional), and Satriani needs to do something besides tying up the courts.

 

Well said! I am amused by the Satriani fans who say "Joe's a nice guy"... yeah, so nice he sues someone for three notes in a different key.. and times it just after the Grammy nominations!

 

There's too much litigation in the world, and the motivating factor for it is greed. What is Joe raising the lawsuit for, if not for money, or perhaps for attention?

 

Why did he wait for over 6 months before noticing? Did he never hear Viva La Vida on the TV or radio in the US for over 6 months... it's been played to death in the US!

 

I honestly don't think Chris would have "stolen music" without seeking permission first, as Richard Ashcroft did with the Rolling Stones, with Bitter Sweet Symphony. Here it's coincidence though, as the key isn't even the same.

 

Just as with that case though, once the song became phenomally popular, the vultures descended.

Coldplay don't deserve to be dragged through the dirt.

 

ohhhhhhhhhhhh THE DIRT!

:laugh3: omg..

 

ok, see - this guitarists is actually nobodym i mean, really - nor me nor my friends ever heard of him....

 

Uh,he's a nobody just because you and your friends don't know who is ?

how old are you kid ?

As much as I want to instantly side with Coldplay, I *do* hear the similarity. If it's enough to warrant a suit... I don't know.

 

I feel bad for Chris though. I hope this doesn't become a big circus. George Harrison fans will remember he was sued by The Chiffons over "My Sweet Lord" (a "Viva la Vida"-style hit single). George described the legal proceedings as terrible... as 'expert' after 'expert' stood up to tear apart every second of his song, he began to doubt himself and his own heart/talent. Can Chris Martin withstand this type of torture? Eek.

 

That's a great point, and no is the answer I think.

torture ?

Yes torture, obviously not in the extreme sense of the word.

 

It's a turn of phrase. Just like "oooh I love that jacket" or "crap Ben is going to kill me" obviously you're not in love with a jacket and your friend Ben isn't going to actually kill you.

 

I'm assuming you asked as you didn't understand the context of the word, not to just wind us up, so I hope this has been informative for you :wink:

Dejan

 

20, did I offend you?

 

or may be you are him. well, I dont know ANYONE who knows the guy. Just the way it is. The fact, i'd say. Pitty but

"It's more then 4-5 "notes". He wouldn't get all the proceeds from the entire album. You guys make some pretty wild guesses."

 

Except that if you actually search for the documents in quewstion (and they have been posted somewhere-maybe the smoking gun? I'm to tired to go back and find it right now...), you'll see that he seems to be more interestd in punative damages than actual compensation or credit for asong he thinks he wrote, which to me turns any legitimate complaint he has (and he might well have one IMHO), into a simple cashgrab. I assume Satriani has done quite well for himself based on his success, but I would be astounded if he has anything close to Coldplay money, and everyone could use the assload of cash that comes from holding the rights to a single as big as VLV...

 

Coincidently, with the CD analogy, it seems to me that a lot of people would say that IS ok, based on the current debate going on over P2P, DRM etc. But that's an arguement for another thread...

 

"Well said! I am amused by the Satriani fans who say "Joe's a nice guy"... yeah, so nice he sues someone for three notes in a different key.. and times it just after the Grammy nominations!"

 

From all reports though, Satriani IS a nice guy, and though I agree the timing of the lawsuit is fairly suspect, it does take time to prepare to mount a lawsuit, and who knows all the legal stuff that may have been going on "behind the scenes" before now.

That's a great point, and no is the answer I think.

 

Chris comes across as a self-doubting Thomas if ever there was one, and I hope for his sake and ours, as fans of their music, he isn't put through the millstone of a court case.

Will be interesting to see what his demeanour is like at tonight's gig.

"Will be interesting to see what his demeanour is like at tonight's gig"

 

It's not just Chris though. Of all the boys, only Will comes off as a truly confident individual. The rest of them have all had very public moments of doubt over the years.

 

I'm sure the band has known of this for some time though, you don't usually get to the lawsuit phase of this kind of thing without going through a lot of back room wrangling with lawyers and such.

Yeah they have, Chris mentioned it at the Yahoo gig a few weeks ago, I just meant since it's all come out and the suit has formally been filed.

 

I'm sure they'll be fine, just hope Chris keeps his mouth shut when they play it.

I think it's all crap. EVERY person in the world who is not deaf hears songs, and any of those people who go on to create their own songs have SOME inspiration from EVERYTHING they've heard. EVERYONE. You can't say that something is all your own, because "your own" is just a combination of your opinions of everyone else's stuff mixed with some of your own ideas.

 

+.. why isn't this Joe guy suing New Kids On The Block & NeYo? The single "Single" sounds JUST LIKE IT TOO.

[click the title cuz it says the video isn't available but it is on YouTube, just not streamed through to here.]

 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJD-hGEEsKE]YouTube - Single - New Kids On the Block & Ne-Yo - NKOTB[/ame]

I'm sure they'll be fine, just hope Chris keeps his mouth shut when they play it"

 

Most likely, he hve recieved specific legal advice on what he can say safely from this point forward. All of this assumes of course that they will still continue to play the song. They could always employ the tactic Noel Gallagher used with Step Out, whereby he essentially buried the song, so that even though Stevie Wonder owns the rights he essentially got nothing from the song...

It's more then 4-5 "notes". He wouldn't get all the proceeds from the entire album. You guys make some pretty wild guesses.

 

I'm late on this but I do have to agree with you that he would not get all the royalities from the entire album. Instead, he would only get the royalities from the song. The problem with this is that he wants all the royalities from the song but no credit. Where in his lawsuit is he asking for credit? No where, and that is what is really ticking people off.

 

Musicians always say that want credit for their work, but not this guy. Musicians normally ask for credit, and if they wanted, some royalities but not all. Again, this guy is not doing that. If he cares about his work then why isn't he also asking for credit? Why? Because he doesn't really care about his work. I guess the recession has hit his *** hard and he needs money badly.

 

If, and that is a big if, the band did use some of his music by accident then he should only get a percentage of the royalities and not all. I don't think you will find any fan saying that he doesn't deserve some money if that is the case.

Beware... There is a youtube video that is somewhat popular about this. The problem with the youtube video, is the AUDIO has been edited so the songs match.

 

In the video, VLV's pitch has been raised a 1/2 step. And the Joe "I've never heard of this guy" Satriani's song has been lowered just to match the Coldplay ballad. The problem with it is it creates a perception of right-out theft...

 

When listened to the actual songs, they are about 5 half Steps apart from each other. Hopefully this lawsuit gets thrown out. And they aren't even exactly alike.

 

It would be like if Paul McCartney sued Oasis for using a similar tune/lyrics at the beginning of "Fade Away" as "Help."

 

Just ridiculous. The easiest defense for Coldplay would have Kraftwerks come in and testify.

If, and that is a big if, the band did use some of his music by accident then he should only get a percentage of the royalities and not all. I don't think you will find any fan saying that he doesn't deserve some money if that is the case.

If it was an accident then Satriani shouldn't get anything. In my opinion.

Of course there's a vague similarity, there's also a similarity between paranoid android and 42, but that's no crime. But just to highlight their dissimilarity, try singing along with the Joe Satriani chorus (using the original recording), the pitch is way up on a different note, and the second note shoots up higher by comparison than the "the" in Viva la Vida. They don't match by a long a shot. I wouldn't even call it an accident or a coincidence because I'm not convinced the similarity is that eerie.

This needs to get settled quickly. If you can not detect a similarity, at least in that one section (you all know what I am talking about by now), you are deaf. First, Chris Martin specifically (he writes the lyrics and this is a vocal melody that is in question) needs to be honest about whether it is a coincidence or a conscious effort that a section of Viva la Vida sounds like the Satriani song.

 

I can detect a similarity in that short chord progression. I agree that Chris Martin needs to be honest about that vocal melody because according to what he says in this video, this little "thing" (referring to the vocal melody of "I used to rule the world") just came to him late one night. *shrugs*

 

It starts around 1:20

 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTvj4xLZD_4]YouTube - Coldplay talk to Steve Lamacq[/ame]

 

It's a common chord progression. Maybe he did hear Satriani's song somewhere in the past, and who knows, he may not have even known who the artist was. Then the melody and lyrics just pop in his head one day. It happens.

Here is a link to a Coldplay interview in 2002 where they mention Joe

 

http://www.vh1.com/artists/news/1456997/08122002/coldplay.jhtml

It makes sense that they've heard of him as Satriani is pretty well known in musician's circles. However, I still say it's highly unlikely any of the boys have listend that extensively to his work.

 

Also, is it just me or does this whole thing carry the backhanded acusation that Coldplay are Stupid. I mean really, you would have to be pretty dense to willfully rip off another known established artist and think you could get by with it.

 

On a sort of related topic, do labels check at all to see that their major artists are not plagiarizing (intentionally or otherwise) already known work? Seems to me it would be worth their time considering all the time/money/effort they expend to diffuse other potential scandals from their big artists. I mean really, for Coldplay to actually get as far as actually releasing something ripped off someone else, considering all the people involved in preparing such a big album for release, would require a consperacy(sp?) worthy of the X-Files...:laugh3:

If it was an accident then Satriani shouldn't get anything. In my opinion.

 

Well, I agree. I was just saying that because of the courts in this country and how they like to reward money on any and everything.

 

It makes sense that they've heard of him as Satriani is pretty well known in musician's circles. However, I still say it's highly unlikely any of the boys have listend that extensively to his work.

 

Also, is it just me or does this whole thing carry the backhanded acusation that Coldplay are Stupid. I mean really, you would have to be pretty dense to willfully rip off another known established artist and think you could get by with it.

 

On a sort of related topic, do labels check at all to see that their major artists are not plagiarizing (intentionally or otherwise) already known work? Seems to me it would be worth their time considering all the time/money/effort they expend to diffuse other potential scandals from their big artists. I mean really, for Coldplay to actually get as far as actually releasing something ripped off someone else, considering all the people involved in preparing such a big album for release, would require a consperacy(sp?) worthy of the X-Files...:laugh3:

 

Again, I agree with you. I think this incident carries the accusation that Coldplay are stupid. No musician is that stupid, well, except for Vanilla Ice.

 

As to your question as to whether record companies check to see if their artists plagiarized another song....no, they do not. There are millions of songs out there that it would be impossible to know. However, the music execs do listen to the given CD and determine whether or not a song should be put on a CD or not, or whether more songs are needed for the CD. If by chance they hear a familiar tune then they would say something, well hopefully they would say something.

Again? :inquisitive:

"Again, I agree with you. I think this incident carries the accusation that Coldplay are stupid. No musician is that stupid, well, except for Vanilla Ice"

 

:laugh3: