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I ran away

Hypnotised - first song off Kaleidoscope

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IMO Paradise is one of the best words to use it on.

All I can think of when Chris is doing this, is this:

 

Hellroter.jpg

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I slowed down the end in Audacity. Glad you liked it ! :)

 

Oh! I know how to slow down audio in Audacity but it almost seems to gradually slow down, but I can't find a way to do that very easily...

 

All I can think of when Chris is doing this, is this:

 

Hellroter.jpg

 

or this

 

dice.jpg

 

That's the fun of it lol

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Oh! I know how to slow down audio in Audacity but it almost seems to gradually slow down, but I can't find a way to do that very easily...

There is actually a function in the drop-down menu right next to 'change tempo' that says 'change tempo gradually' (I have the German version, so don't know exactly what it is called in English there), and I used this. It's quite easy.

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There is actually a function in the drop-down menu right next to 'change tempo' that says 'change tempo gradually' (I have the German version, so don't know exactly what it is called in English there), and I used this. It's quite easy.

 

Hm, I can't find it...

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Chris's best individual work since VLV

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So I held back from posting anything about Hypnotised for a while. A lot of you guys seemed to like it and I didn't want to be a douche. Though it was mostly because I was trying desperately to like it, forcefully even, and I just can't. I listen to it three or four times a day just searching for a glimmer of light, but my god is it boring. It's the dullest song they've done along with Amazing Day. The song just doesn't go anywhere for six minutes and it's nowhere near as emotionally charged as their early work. I simply don't understand the comparison with anything pre-Viva. A painfully slow song doesn't automatically equate to early Coldplay.

 

And I still dislike the production. The bells are synthed and not real, the drums are electric and Jonny's solo is drowned in a sea of synth white noise and uncomplimentary strings (The Pink Floyd comparisons almost killed me. I think sir Gilmour might shoot himself too if he read this!) The piano rhythm is way too slow and could have been written by a preschooler with a keyboard, and don't even get me stared on the lyrics. Once you compare it with O, All Your Friends or Up with the Birds the weaknesses really start to show.

 

Overall I'm neither sad nor disappointed, just rather bewildered, with the band seemingly unable to capture the magic of what made them great in the first place, even though they evidently tried their hardest to do so. Kaleidoscope will be a dreadful end to an era that can't come soon enough.

 

I still hold on to my belief that Ghost Story and Atlas are the most original Coldplay songs post-Viva. Both songs masterfully written and crafted. Songs that fill your head with a lot of what ifs... In fact Coldplay's career these past 10 years is filled with what ifs. The older members will know I've called for the band to go on a prolonged hiatus since Viva only to be more disappointed with every release year after year . Hopefully in 2017 the time will come.

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The older members will know I've called for the band to go on a prolonged hiatus since Viva only to be more disappointed with every release year after year . Hopefully in 2017 the time will come.

 

Just wondering:

why do you think a long hiatus will make a difference? Let's say they stop making music for 3 years and then start again...

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Criticism is always a reflection of one’s ability to understand someone or something, I guess. After all it´s just a personal opinion, nothing else. When we start to give opinions to much weight and start to take ourselves too serious is where we start hurting others. We believe and start to give other the impression that our opinion is the right one. But the truth is, that the moment you understand what this song or whatever is about, you would probably never arrogate to yourself any criticism… It doesn´t help that you wait long to tell that a song is dull or whatever – it doesn´t hurt people who loves the song less, to hear something that they can connect to and soothes them being put down by somebody.

 

I know it´s just your opinion and that is just a reflection of your state in life, but could it be, that when something you don't like gets so important to you, your problem is not this song but something else?

 

But really that is just my point of view! :)

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Criticism is always a reflection of one’s ability to understand someone or something, I guess. After all it´s just a personal opinion, nothing else. When we start to give opinions to much weight and start to take ourselves too serious is where we start hurting others. We believe and start to give other the impression that our opinion is the right one. But the truth is, that the moment you understand what this song or whatever is about, you would probably never arrogate to yourself any criticism… It doesn´t help that you wait long to tell that a song is dull or whatever – it doesn´t hurt people who loves the song less, to hear something that they can connect to and soothes them being put down by somebody.

 

I know it´s just your opinion and that is just a reflection of your state in life, but could it be, that when something you don't like gets so important to you, your problem is not this song but something else?

 

But really that is just my point of view! :)

 

so you are... criticizing someone else's criticism? giving too much weight to opinions means you can give too much weight to positive opinions as well, ignoring potential negatives. it's only fair that we get to hear those perspectives, too, no matter what causes the person to feel that way.

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Criticism is always a reflection of one’s ability to understand someone or something, I guess. After all it´s just a personal opinion, nothing else. When we start to give opinions to much weight and start to take ourselves too serious is where we start hurting others. We believe and start to give other the impression that our opinion is the right one. But the truth is, that the moment you understand what this song or whatever is about, you would probably never arrogate to yourself any criticism… It doesn´t help that you wait long to tell that a song is dull or whatever – it doesn´t hurt people who loves the song less, to hear something that they can connect to and soothes them being put down by somebody.

 

I know it´s just your opinion and that is just a reflection of your state in life, but could it be, that when something you don't like gets so important to you, your problem is not this song but something else?

 

But really that is just my point of view! :)

 

Hi, I love Hypnotised too, actually very much so, but @nvdmm just stated his personal opinion, and he did it not in a harsh or impolite way. He can state whatever opinion he wants to just like everyone else here.

Everybody has different opinions, everybody has different tastes and has the right to criticise a song without being accused of not understanding it, as you just did. In fact, everything you just wrote could be applied to your opinion as well. Live and let live.

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So I held back from posting anything about Hypnotised for a while. A lot of you guys seemed to like it and I didn't want to be a douche. Though it was mostly because I was trying desperately to like it, forcefully even, and I just can't. I listen to it three or four times a day just searching for a glimmer of light, but my god is it boring. It's the dullest song they've done along with Amazing Day. The song just doesn't go anywhere for six minutes and it's nowhere near as emotionally charged as their early work. I simply don't understand the comparison with anything pre-Viva. A painfully slow song doesn't automatically equate to early Coldplay.

 

And I still dislike the production. The bells are synthed and not real, the drums are electric and Jonny's solo is drowned in a sea of synth white noise and uncomplimentary strings (The Pink Floyd comparisons almost killed me. I think sir Gilmour might shoot himself too if he read this!) The piano rhythm is way too slow and could have been written by a preschooler with a keyboard, and don't even get me stared on the lyrics. Once you compare it with O, All Your Friends or Up with the Birds the weaknesses really start to show.

 

Overall I'm neither sad nor disappointed, just rather bewildered, with the band seemingly unable to capture the magic of what made them great in the first place, even though they evidently tried their hardest to do so. Kaleidoscope will be a dreadful end to an era that can't come soon enough.

 

I still hold on to my belief that Ghost Story and Atlas are the most original Coldplay songs post-Viva. Both songs masterfully written and crafted. Songs that fill your head with a lot of what ifs... In fact Coldplay's career these past 10 years is filled with what ifs. The older members will know I've called for the band to go on a prolonged hiatus since Viva only to be more disappointed with every release year after year . Hopefully in 2017 the time will come.

While I don't personally despise it as much as you do (but I certainly don't adore it either!), I definitely agree on a lot of your points. I really just find it... OK. People comparing it to Viva or Death is pretty ridiculous, comparisons to Amazing Day are 100% most accurate, but again I don't necessarily hate AD, but they're both so similar in that they're pitch-wise similar and are quite dreary and overall have a very similar vibe. Honestly, with the lyrics, when you really think about it, these are some of his best lyrics FOR THIS ERA. AHFOD's lyrics were pretty poor and his lyrics have obviously been pretty shocking for the past several years, but whenever people complain about Chris recent lyrics (including myself) I always remember this: Chris has NEVER been a fantastic, let alone very good lyric-writer. He is probably one of the most derided song/lyric-writers of 21st century pop-music, and rightfully so. And some people will mention some lyrics from Parachutes, or AROBTTH, or even something from any era (a lot of people seem to specifically bring up lyrics from GS) that works and say 'Well what about this lyric, it's really fantastic etc...", and while there are few standouts amongst the band's catalogue that actually are kind of great lyrically, we need to really look deeper and think about the level of sophistication, not even really, present in the lyrics, even the ones which people mention as being some "really good lyrics that prove that Chris is a brilliant lyric-writer", which overall, turn out to be quite basic.

 

With production, honestly, I think that a lot of the complaints our fanbase has about the production are a load of bullshit. Not necessarily invalidating yours, but it pisses me off so much when all of these people say stuff like "Stargate made AHFOD shit" and "the production on SJLT is shocking". Like FUCK OFF, it's just the idea of their production on the songs acting as a placebo on the people who complain because deep down, they simply just WANT to hate it because these flashy pop-focused producers are coming in. I bet that if there was some sort of blind experiment where we could test which versions of songs people prefer without them knowing who produced them, a lot of the results would contradict what people love to currently say and we would see that it's not up to Stargate. And besides, what percentage of those people even has a clue about the difference between good and bad music production? You need to have A LOT of experience in that kind of stuff, and I know that while there may be some who can genuinely hear it, most can't. Really I think the main complaint people have with it is that it's too refined - which pisses me off as well. It's again the idea of "typical mainstream pop" which people will jump at hating. As if having a song sound more "raw" absolutely has to make it better. I'm sorry to sound so negative about this, but it's something SO MANY of us do, and it really annoys me.

 

But overall, I don't mind the song. For me, it's a mix of slightly boring and pretty sweet and beautiful. I don't know how to follow both. It's giving me mixed signals about Kaleidoscope, but I think I can kind of tell what the whole vibe of the EP will be from the song (and also the other soundcheck from last year at the Rose Bowl).

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You are problably right; I should stop to criticize criticism and turn to something I like! Sorry for any disturbances. :grinning:

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While I don't personally despise it as much as you do (but I certainly don't adore it either!), I definitely agree on a lot of your points. I really just find it... OK. People comparing it to Viva or Death is pretty ridiculous, comparisons to Amazing Day are 100% most accurate, but again I don't necessarily hate AD, but they're both so similar in that they're pitch-wise similar and are quite dreary and overall have a very similar vibe. Honestly, with the lyrics, when you really think about it, these are some of his best lyrics FOR THIS ERA. AHFOD's lyrics were pretty poor and his lyrics have obviously been pretty shocking for the past several years, but whenever people complain about Chris recent lyrics (including myself) I always remember this: Chris has NEVER been a fantastic, let alone very good lyric-writer. He is probably one of the most derided song/lyric-writers of 21st century pop-music, and rightfully so. And some people will mention some lyrics from Parachutes, or AROBTTH, or even something from any era (a lot of people seem to specifically bring up lyrics from GS) that works and say 'Well what about this lyric, it's really fantastic etc...", and while there are few standouts amongst the band's catalogue that actually are kind of great lyrically, we need to really look deeper and think about the level of sophistication, not even really, present in the lyrics, even the ones which people mention as being some "really good lyrics that prove that Chris is a brilliant lyric-writer", which overall, turn out to be quite basic.

+1

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complaints our fanbase has about the production are a load of bullshit. Not necessarily invalidating yours, but it pisses me off so much when all of these people say stuff like "Stargate made AHFOD shit" and "the production on SJLT is shocking". Like FUCK OFF, it's just the idea of their production on the songs acting as a placebo on the people who complain because deep down, they simply just WANT to hate it because these flashy pop-focused producers are coming in.

Well the wording you choose there is pretty offensive !

Stargate's production style might fit some other acts perfectly, but for a band very much relying on guitar lines it is not suited. This is the reason why songs like Up&Up sound so much better live than on the disc. Of course that's not Stargate's fault, it is Coldplay who chose them as producers, so their decision.

You don't need to have studied music production for ten years to pick up on the differences. It is not an art to hear if the guitar gets buried underneath chopped-up vocals or other noises.

And as for your blind experiment suggestion, well, when Hypnotised first came out nobody knew who had produced it, and yet the comments in the first minutes of its release unanimously said the production was so clean and good - a total contrast about what people said about AHFOD's production.

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I can certainly point out my gripes with Mylo Xyloto and AHFOD and how I feel about them sonically. Hell I still wince during Spies when they break into the bridge because Will's cymbal crash feels like it's ripping my speakers. I think a large portion of the reason I keep MX so low in my personal opinion is because of how it turned out from production.

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I can certainly point out my gripes with Mylo Xyloto and AHFOD and how I feel about them sonically. Hell I still wince during Spies when they break into the bridge because Will's cymbal crash feels like it's ripping my speakers. I think a large portion of the reason I keep MX so low in my personal opinion is because of how it turned out from production.

 

I have felt the same way since MX! It's as if during the mastering phase someone really pushed the compressor to the limit, and yeah the music sounds loud, but it lost quite a bit of the dynamics and is rather harsh. I often listen via monitor headphones and don't experience the clarity any more that was there in viva. Sometimes I really wonder, like, they can afford any equipment, any studio, any pros to work with and this is what we get? Weird.

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Just wondering:

why do you think a long hiatus will make a difference? Let's say they stop making music for 3 years and then start again...

That's a very good question. As you know bands have a drastically different approach to their work compared to other occupations, engineers for example. Their whole survivability depends on creative output and that depends on every element they're exposed to at any time. When bands continuously make music for lets say a decade, they usually fall into the habit of looking at the whole process as a day job. This is more evident in bands who have a main driving force who dictates all aspects of their sound and pretty much sets the direction and the tone. Coldplay are a definitive example of this. So were Keane and a lot of other bands, even PF before Waters left. Not so much with Linkin Park or Anathema for instance where every single member of the band is pretty much a songwriter and so everyone is considerably more responsible and involved from the get-go.

 

We all know how Coldplay works. Chris comes up with a melody or rhythm, sometimes with disjointed lyrics and often with a whole song, and the rest of the band try to compliment the sound with their individual input. From MX onward I feel like they've become session musicians more or less, just following whatever Chris has in mind. This is why Viva was such a great album. A true masterpiece. Eno came in and broke that chain, giving space to others so they can explore and discover. It sounded fresh and original, unlike anything they or any other alternative band had done.

 

A hiatus is extremely healthy as the band take a break from all group activity for a long time and are no longer artistically involved in a joint activity. It breaks the chain and allows them to take a step back and reflect on their output. They will question the quality of their records and how they stand in the greater scheme of things and examine the band dynamics. Most importantly it helps them develop critical thinking when it comes to making music as a group and in most bands leads to experimentation. Coldplay are a very happy band now, completely indifferent to what you and I think or like or where they stand in the music industry or if they're actually producing music worth listening to. They've fallen into the trap of thinking chart success is an indication of their capability as musicians but they couldn't be more wrong. Charts are about glorified entertainers and no worthy artist in history has ever cared about enduring commercial presence. Coldplay aren't like other bands though and I can't guarantee you a hiatus could work. They might go on holiday and come back after 3 years as if nothing changed. I think Chris is too much of a dominant lead and the others are unable or unwilling to challenge him or present fresh ideas for experimentation. And this is as bad as it gets for a rock band!

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Well, I'm also a fan of a Belgian band who were a bit in the same treadmill.

Record - tour - record - tour...

Then they had a 4 year long hiatus and came back.

The new CD was good but I'm just not sure if the hiatus had anything to do with it.

 

I can tell you that for a fan, such a long hiatus is not fun.

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I wouldn't say a lot has changed in their band dynamics in general. I think Chris always very much was the leader, before their first record all through Parachutes, AROBTTH and X&Y. I don't think Chris being the leader is a bad thing per se. Unfortunately Chris's musical taste and understanding of what makes good music has changed drastically.

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I wouldn't say a lot has changed in their band dynamics in general. I think Chris always very much was the leader, before their first record all through Parachutes, AROBTTH and X&Y. I don't think Chris being the leader is a bad thing per se. Unfortunately Chris's musical taste and understanding of what makes good music has changed drastically.

 

honestly, i don't even think his taste and understanding have changed really, just his perspective on the kind of music he feels obligated to make, if that makes sense? and sure, other things have factored into that, too, but it's as if pre-Viva Chris had many, many preconceived notions about what kind of music is OK and what's not OK (which i'm certain plenty of people still believe in, that's not a good or bad thing per se). watching old interviews sometimes it feels like hearing a different person talk, someone who had a clear image he was trying to live up to and talking down about anything that was sort of against that image (but at the same time not always fully committing, like every time he clarifies "SOFT rock star"). maybe some of that changed because of things outside of his control, the way the band continued to gain popularity yet amass harsher criticism over the years and as people have pointed out before, certain friendships he's made with other musical artists. but i get this feeling that the eye-opening experience the band had with Eno which helped them to produce an album as awesome as VLVODAAHF (and PM, it's great too) also played a factor in shaping the band today.

so now Chris talks about just wanting to be himself, and of course he's mentioned this a lot in the past few years, thinking like in the Zane Lowe interview he talks about how it's become normal to like many different genres at the same time, about how freeing that is. in Live 2012 talking about how they're trying not to care so much what other people think - yet Chris is 100% a people pleaser, which means that not caring what other people think is not actually possible and may lead to this sort of "charts"-centered thinking that was mentioned earlier, especially if all you're trying to do now is focus on the people who like your work... maybe some of the overall goals have changed, from being the best band ever and becoming the next U2 or something to being the band who was able to bring the most amount of people together, because that's easier to quantify

 

well, i apparently had way more thoughts on this than i realized. sorry :p but i just want to say i don't mean to condone or criticize Chris either way right now, these are merely my observations and what i understand based on what i've seen over the years :shrug: but i'd love to hear other opinions on this, too.

 

i'm done, i promise. :P

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So many great comments here! Everyone has a lot good to say.

 

@nvdmm -- Those are fair criticisms to this track. My first thought is that it sounded like a lullaby for toddlers with 70's classic rock thrown in. Arpeggiated pianos are overdone, I'm with you there, and it does drag a bit. I overall really like the song and think the mixing is far more clear than on most of AHFOD, but yes, it feels less organic than Viva and before. Really agree that the band is too Chris dominant, based on the evidence we have. It hurts the amazing contributions Will and Guy have to make. I would argue that Birds and Up&Up are some of the best "rock" songs we have got from them ever, but again, its under the veil of pop. Its hard to love AHFOD for me, but I really like it too--very inconsistent.

 

@I ran away Totally agree about production. None of us are experts here, but when you play something at a moderate level on your headphones you should be able to feel and hear the layers cleanly. There should be range, as if something is approaching or leaving your space. AHFOD did this really well sometimes (Birds), but sometimes music feels blurred and fuzzy (chorus of HFTW). So when Hypnotised dropped, I felt like the fact I could hear acoustic guitar in the foreground and drums slowly building up was a victory in the production department. BUT

 

@msimo4 We aren't experts, and we ultimately don't know how decisions were made or whether bombastic production was their actual choice. We shouldn't make comments that are too drastic like "this production is pop crap, worst of all time" because it just is another style that others might enjoy! ASFOS sounds great loud when you are driving a car fast, because you want it to hit you like a gust of wind. But if you are listening to it trying to find complex textures and chord structure, well, not the right song buddy. Also, I totally have said "Screw Stargate," but who knows if they actually made tracks much better in some cases? And yeah, we can't ever expect Chris to do good lyrics. Maybe every once in a while he will surprise us, but lets not get our hopes up.

 

@coldplayisawesome Right? I am so confused when Chris is like "I don't care who listens to us, but I am also a 40 year old man who just collaborated with the Chainsmokers and 'inadvertently' putting Coldplay back in the mind of young people!" I believe the guy truthfully loves pop EDM, but he also wrote Spies, Politik, and Chinese Sleep Chant. WHO ARE YOU!?!? Also, I love that mixing genres is apparently freeing for him--but that is one of the hardest things to do in music. To make a song like "Daddy Lessons" like Beyonce that appeals to hip-hop, r&b, and country crowd is tough. On AHFOD every song tried to have some crossover appeal and I think that's what made tracks a little weaker. Sometimes sticking to a concept is best (Parachutes, Viva, MX, GS)

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quite a few good points. i feel like chris was much more dominant in the early days than he is now. without a question he is the dominant leader there. like @nvdmm mentioned, brian eno definitely broke that mold. and we got the most musically cohesive, but diverse and progressed album.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=id=1Fsk3sQyZt8;m=41;s=3

Mobile Link: https://youtu.be/1Fsk3sQyZt8?t=41m3s

 

 

(how strange is it that this is leading up to mx and a few of us would consider that the start of the downward spiral?)

 

i still think coldplay learned a lot from the time with brian eno and one of those is probably band dynamics. but from the beginning i remember seeing quotes from will for example how the band ran on chris' drive and his doom or sunshine personality. as the whole band grew up, all of them seem to have settled on to content lives. chris doesn't seem that driven any more (still very driven) and not out to prove anything, like they were until mx. can you imagine last decade's coldplay doing that superbowl show? it sure has hurt the band output. and a mindset like "But in terms of writing, I think it’s about not judging what comes through. And that’s how the catchy bits happen." can't really help the quality of output.

 

i feel like the whole band has fallen into a happy, routinely rut. so they are trying to spruce up their new music by trying to go in not-so-working directions. they don't seem to want to revisit the early days in a significant form, no matter how much we wish. it is obvious from the past several years that coldplay are always trying new things to keep their interest. i'm sure commercial success/crowd pleasing factor in there somewhere too. but guy has been repeating this quite a lot. so it is not chris driven, alone.

 

what i'm hoping for is for the band stop trying to write hits for the "teenage crowd". maybe this is what we'll get until their kids grow up enough to call the music they are making today "cheesy"

 

 

ps. you know maybe we should try to have the band listen to some of their earlier interviews.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=id=1Fsk3sQyZt8;m=43;s=46

Mobile Link: https://youtu.be/1Fsk3sQyZt8?t=43m46s

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